How does Stonewall define the word woman?

[custardcreme]

Stonewall say on their website that language is important, and so they have a glossary to explain all the terms. Except (as far as I can tell) ‘woman’ (or ‘man’).

Language does matter and if they or anyone else is going to claim TWAW, as Stonewall do, then they’d better be sure of what a woman is.

Has anyone seen their definition of the word? I’d be very interested to know it.

(Sorry if it’s easily findable, I did google briefly and looked at their website; couldn’t find anything but appreciate that doesn’t mean it’s not out there)

We can speculate about how they might define a woman, but we can’t know for sure, because they refuse to do it. And they presumably refuse to do it because they’ll end up at ‘a person who wears dresses and lipstick’, won’t they? Because what else can they say? Feeling like a woman doesn’t work, as we’ve established, because how can you if you can’t define what one is. And adult human female isn’t allowed. Talk about a sodding house of cards.

I have no idea with how anyone can suggest the definition of something is whatever someone says about it.

No. Definitions are objective. Noone suggests that it's reasonable for people to just label themselves as black, or as 10 years old (even though colour IS arguably socially constructed).

So why on earth would anyone argue that sex is socially constructed?

How stupid do you have to be to believe that?? Do they really think that women fought for the vote for no reason, given they could have just identified as men for the day? Do they think that women in menstrual huts or subject to honour killings should just up and leave and claim to be men now? That all the millions of aborted female foetuses were killed because they had made it known they wished to identify as female?

No. Everyone knows exactly who women are. There is never any difficulty in deciding who to disenfranchise, who to sexually assault, who to publicly bully, who to block and who to abuse.

Their glossary doesn't have specific definition but does use woman/ man a lot elsewhere. The usage confirms they are gender identities and... So are female / male. They may update those mentions soon as current dominant position is you can't change sex. (Massive change in longstanding general assertion that you could. With usual denial previous position ever existed).

Eg

Gender identity
A person’s innate sense of their own gender, whether male, female or something else (see non-binary below), which may or may not correspond to the sex assigned at birth.

Loads usage like that through glossary.

And not the topic but here's the long-standing one where they discourage use of the term homosexual strongly, and then replace same sex attraction with same gender attraction and happily redefine both homosexual and gay as nothing to do with people's sex. IE blatent unapologetic homophobia, erasure of same sex attraction as a concept, and appropriate the words for it.

Homosexual
This might be considered a more medical term used to describe someone who has a romantic and/or sexual orientation towards someone of the same gender. The term ‘gay’ is now more generally used.

@Nellodee

Isn't woman supposed to be a changing set of societal norms the days? That's a clear enough definition that doesn't include the word woman, isn't it?

Surely these norms need to be clearly defined then?

My aunt calls herself a “butch lesbian”. She wears clothes from the men’s section of shops. Has short hair. Wears men’s shoes and aftershave. Has never been pregnant or given birth. Works as a pharmacist.

I can’t see anything about her that conforms to the societal norms of women. Does this mean she’s not a woman?

@Nellodee

Isn't woman supposed to be a changing set of societal norms the days? That's a clear enough definition that doesn't include the word woman, isn't it?

No, it's not clear, it's functionally useless. If that really was the 'definition' of 'woman' then all relevant laws and healthcare info etc would need to be rewritten to use 'female'.

@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken
*My aunt calls herself a “butch lesbian”. She wears clothes from the men’s section of shops. Has short hair. Wears men’s shoes and aftershave. Has never been pregnant or given birth. Works as a pharmacist.

I can’t see anything about her that conforms to the societal norms of women. Does this mean she’s not a woman?*

But does she have the feelz of a woman? That's all that counts apparently. Although I guess that her feelz wouldn't be the right type according to the men that have decided these things

No no no that's not how it works!

The whole point is that each male who has a trans feminine identity of any type. Has their own, personal understanding of what women are like, there can be no definition because it's a personal journey for every trans person!

In fact it's expected that each individual will identify with certain aspects. Not all! If a TW feels the main aspects, and the ones that they relate to and are the ones that mean they are a woman. Then they are a woman.

Simple!

The parts which aren't that fun but are universally or widely expected. They don't seem to come up at all that I've seen. Some enjoy things that mainly apply to women but most women and girls don't like. Eg cat calling, leering random men. I did read a prominent TW say women and girls who don't like it are trying to spoil the fun, they are prudish killjoys and also weak to feel upset rather than giving as good as they get in a sassy way. Not exact words!

The whole point is that woman, girl. Must NOT have any solid definition whatsoever.

They mean whatever any individual man wants it to mean. Restrictions on who you are are so regressive and oppressive.

I mean fuck off seriously. But also given that, it's hardly surprising that no definition is forthcoming. Apart from a few which have been extraordinarily sexist and grim.