Awards for "people who identify as women"

[HelloTreacle9]

I've got a situation at work I'm not comfortable with and would welcome thoughts. We are involved in an awards scheme for young women around the world in the industry I work in. This year, the criteria have changed so the award is not for young women but for 'people who identify as women.' It's led out of the US, where I understand the GC debate is rather different to here, and I was not involved in this decision. But, quietly, I don't subscribe to gender ideology and while I've never mentioned this at work before, I don't feel able to get involved in championing this scheme. I have raised it as neutrally as possible with my US counterpart (saying it's possible they might get some negative comments from the UK, not sharing my own view) but she sees it as "progressive". The easiest way forward is probably to pretend it's not happening and just not get involved, but I'm also pretty pissed off that in an industry with a huge pay gap between men and women, and other significant inequities relating specifically to women, we're now saying that an award that was intended to elevate those women who are succeeding despite all of that, actually isn't. I don't know whether to make my point more strongly, or if that is still too risky.

So non-binary females and transmen are no longer eligible. That's not very inclusive. Quite apart from women who don't buy into gender identity at all; I guess they're excluded too.

The world has gone mad.

If you feel able to, don't let it drop. Take a while to compose an email talking about the challenges young girls face across the world maybe even within your own company ie pay gap etc.. and how you feel these girls should not be disadvantaged further. Could you suggest a trans award? That's a good compromise?

Yes, maybe a duel award. Because if there's one thing that's almost guaranteed, if the award is for those who identify as a woman, the type of woman who won't be getting it is the type who is a woman.

I agree. Turn it around and say you don’t think it’s very inclusive as it excludes non binary etc etc. Suggest in the context of the gender pay gap in your industry a more inclusive option would be a second category for trans and non binary.

I sympathise OP. UK staff voicing dissent from US gender religion at a US led company will get 'labeled'.

It might be worth asking sex matters for advice

"I don't support removing the 'young woman award'. I don't have a gender identity and don't identify as anything, so I'm excluded. I'd support an identity award as an addition but what about those of us who don't have a gender identity?."

Maybe go back to the initial purpose of the award. If it was to address a sex based issue (such as fewer females in the industry) then how does opening the award up to males also help address that issue.

Is there any evidence there needs to be an award for ‘people who identify as women’.

Are they going to ask people their gender identity as part of the award process?

Asking questions is an approach

'Woman' is inclusive of all races, all ages, all physical abilities or disabilities, all personalities, all sexual orientations, all politics, all preferences. Whereas 'identify as a woman' is not inclusive of females. I don't identify as a woman, I am a woman.

in an industry with a huge pay gap between men and women, and other significant inequities relating specifically to women, is this going the same way as the finance industry where senior males on higher salaries transition, identify as women, and get a woman's award over female staff on lower salaries?

Thanks all. Lots of food for thought here. I think asking some questions is a good way forward. And I do agree it's more exclusionary than inclusive, in this rather upside down world we find ourselves in.

Good luck. Also.. just saw this and thought of your situation

TWEET

WTFoucault @WTFoucault

Do you believe in gender identity? Then you believe that women are pre-destined to look, feel and behave in a particular way, and men in another. You share this belief with social conservatives, most organised religion, rape apologists - in fact, with the rest of the patriarchy.

I don't know whether to make my point more strongly, or if that is still too risky.

To whom can you make the point and will it have any effect?

Can you inform the award directly that you will no longer be supporting them?

@FindTheTruth not the thread topic but where has this happened in the finance industry? Would be useful to have an eg or two!

[quote timeisnotaline]@FindTheTruth not the thread topic but where has this happened in the finance industry? Would be useful to have an eg or two![/quote]
Pips/Philip Bunce, a senior director at Credit Suisse who wore female clothing and a wig part of the time (some days Philip, other days Pippa) - which apparently made them eligible to enter & win awards for top female execs in business

[quote timeisnotaline]@FindTheTruth not the thread topic but where has this happened in the finance industry? Would be useful to have an eg or two![/quote]
Article on Mr Bunce from 2018 www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6197705/City-workers-hit-gender-fluid-banker-works-days-Philip-Pippa.html

www.gendertrending.com/2018/09/21/financial-times-places-male-sexual-harasser-philip-bunce-on-list-of-top-100-female-business-executives/

Relevant tweet twitter.com/creditsuisse/status/1042723980979908608?s=21 Suggest read the replies and quote tweets

I stopped leading a ‘woman in [specific area in tech]’ initiative as I just couldn’t bear to do a lot of work to try and encourage women then see their awards be handed to the males

Thanks both! I’m in FS so helpful to be able to point to something if this comes up.

timeisnotaline another relevant twitter thread with some revealing photos twitter.com/veza76_1/status/1453629344308506628?s=21

That last thread 😬

Leaving aside the appropriateness of two of the outfits for work and whether his born female colleagues would get away with wearing them at a bank (they wouldn’t, obviously)… he’s too old for that short dress.

IMO, it’s similar to when you see middle aged, recently divorced guys trying to squeeze into SuperDry in a futile effort to turn the clock back.