Further developments on the netflix protest

[Stealhsquirrelnutkin]

This is really upsetting. Remember the big chap with the "jokes are funny sign" at the Netflix walkout? The one who had his sign destroyed by a netflix author who tried to get the crowd to beat him up (or law enforcement to shoot him) by shouting HE HAS A WEAPON?

In his first video released soon afterwards - where we got to laugh at the ridiculous REPENT MOTHERFUCKER tambourine/rattlesnake woman, - he also mentioned that his friend had been attacked and knocked over, and that his head was still hurting. And also that they were chased to their car by a bunch of very threatening antifa thugs.
In this new video update he is visibly shaken. He has just seen footage of what actually happened to his friend.

First he reads how the incident was reported by biased media, describing him and his friend Dick, and their good natured protest (signs reading "We Like Dave" and "Jokes are Funny") as evidence of the violent tendencies Dave Chappelle stirs up in right wing fanatics. The article says that his friend used the stick from his sign to put someone in a chokehold, using the stick to throttle them, but "luckily an antifascist was able to jump in and break his hold on the unidentified persons neck.

Then he shows video footage of the incident, and what actually happened is really shocking.
Firstly, the innocent protester put in a chokehold by the violent stick wielding thug turns out to be the very same blue t-shirt guy who broke Vito's sign and tried to get him killed by shouting the "he has a weapon" warning.

Then you see that what really happens is that the bloke's wife comes forward, she gets right up in his personal space, with her arms out, and while Dick is distracted blue t-shirt guy manages to insert himself between Dick and the stick attached to his sign.

He's trying to pull the sign away so he can destroy it like he did earlier with Vito, but Dick doesn't let go of the stick, he holds it with two hands so that the writer/provocateur is standing in front of him, between him and the stick, refusing to move. Dick is shouting "he's grabbing my stuff". He's very carefully not touching the sign grabber, just holding on to his own stick with both hands. Then a thug with his face hidden under a blue mask comes up and violently pushes him over, then purposefully slams his head onto a decorative concrete ball. He's obviously shocked and hurt, he tries to get someone to help him, and the bloke who attacked him immediately says "you were choking someone". Which is the lie the media reports as if it was truth.

The video shows very clearly what really happened. Without it there would just be his word against the antifa liars. It's exactly the same as what happened when that thug Tara Wolf (also known as Tara Flik Wood), a trans-identified male, beat up Maria MacLachlan after announcing on Facebook that he was going to “fuck up some TERFs” his mates lied under oath making up a story where Maria was a crazed hells granny who put one enormous lout in a headlock and threw them around like a rag doll. Fortunately, in that case too, there was very clear video evidence of what actually happened.

Vito is so upset by the video, and by the fact that his friend Dick still has symptoms from having his head smashed into concrete. By the lies that are being spread on social media about what happened, that paint him and Dick as violent fascist thugs, and by the fact that the antifa nutjobs who chased them to their car have uploaded footage showing their license plate onto social media, making it easy for deranged people to get hold of the home address and turn up to show their displeasure with guns or molotov cocktails.

The fact that it was the same netflix author who instigated the skirmishes both times, and after trying and failing to get security to shoot Vito, or the crowd to beat him to death by shouting that he was armed, then went on to position himself between Dick and his sign so that he could pretend he was being choked, and this time he really did manage to get his target seriously hurt.

I really hope Dick makes a full recovery, but everyone knows that head injuries can cause permanent brain damage and personality changes. I also hope that their legal case against the netflix author and antifa smurf is very successful and lucrative that they both think good and hard before pulling the same vile stunts on anyone else.

'Look what you made me do!'

It wouldn't surprise me if the TRAs try to pin their aggression on Dave Chapelle because of course they are always the victims, never the wrongdoers

[quote nauticant]Where you are so used to being able to do stuff with no consequences or even positive results that you become utterly reckless and euphoric believeing you will get away with anything...

The same concept exists in other contexts, for example where it's been called Affluenza: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethan_Couch[/quote]
The horseshoe of this brings them close to Trump and the members of the GOP who participated in the assault on the Capitol.

The culture of impunity is strong and has kissing cousins from what should be very divergent parts of the political spectrum.

So upsetting to watch - look at what's happening to people and what it's spiralling out to, and as far as Vito is concerned, this has happened to him and his friend and neither of them have even said the word 'trans' once.

Look at how the article he shares has them and the 'Dave is funny' sign tinted devil red, with the upstanding hero protester in centre focus holding a sign that says "it's my 30th (?) birthday and I stand with my trans siblings". A silly touch that says so much - me, me, me my birthday Dave Chappelle's a meany. It's absolutely insane.

@Kotatsu

Videos already removed - it's as though they don't want people to know about this...

Nope they are still there on his channel

Nope they are still there on his channel

Vito's commentary is still there for me from the links above.

I have often wondered how authoritarian regimes take hold. Not up in government so much but the everyday person on the street. Who did what? How did it look? How did they justify it to themselves? Thanks to social media and ease of access to cameras/phones etc we are seeing it right now. I am scared this can’t be wheeled back. Someone on a podcast I listened to said it never goes back to what it was once it starts. They can reduce the extreme behaviour and bring back balance of a kind but things never return to how they were.

I find it so depressing that my children won’t know the ease of expression and social tool of debate with which matters important to them were discussed and settled without violence, lies and character assassination. I saw a thread the other day on here where people, even now, were denying “cancellation” was a thing and stating that it’s not something you ever need to worry about if you don’t engage in “hate speech”. Still people cannot see what “cancellation” means, how it is similar to how “wrong thinkers” were shut down and silenced in previous historical authoritarian regimes. They blind themselves to how it will be misused and that it is just human nature to do so - to take the easy path to a win and shutting down your opponent. So naive.

I really hope this is reported to the police. Surely that person is guilty of assault?

Oh my goodness, this is unbelievable. Eustress is absolutely applicable, they think they are untouchable. Just when you think it can't get any more blatant. Very shocking indeed.

On the thread about the LGB Alliance conference a poster commented that the reason the LGBA draws so much ire is because its existence means that transactivists can no longer force-team LGB people. I think one of the reasons The Closer has pressed buttons is that transactivists are desperate to force-team black people and Chappelle has correctly identified the people who most benefit from gender ideology are those who already have power. He says that some people's hurt feelings matter more than actual black lives. He says that white men saying, 'I'm a woman now!' is about who gets to make the rules. This is one of the reasons transactivists are trying to shut this down. When Vito was chanting, 'I like Dave! Jokes are funny!' a white woman in the crowd started the non-sequitor chant of 'Black lives matter!' It is all sinister and totalitarian.

One of the things that is frequently brought up on The Mess We're In podcast is the Trumpian nature of transactivism's relationship with the truth. Here we have people who know they are being filmed and yet they are perfectly willing to tell the most brazen lies on camera. Evidence no longer matters.

On the thread about the LGB Alliance conference a poster commented that the reason the LGBA draws so much ire is because its existence means that transactivists can no longer force-team LGB people. I think one of the reasons The Closer has pressed buttons is that transactivists are desperate to force-team black people and Chappelle has correctly identified the people who most benefit from gender ideology are those who already have power. He says that some people's hurt feelings matter more than actual black lives. He says that white men saying, 'I'm a woman now!' is about who gets to make the rules. This is one of the reasons transactivists are trying to shut this down.

That explanation makes an awful lot of sense when I see it written down. It gives an understandable reason for the completely over the top hatred and violence that has been unleashed against the LGB alliance and Chappelle.

It also explains why they are provoked into telling such outrageous and obvious lies. It happens to spontaneously for it to be anything but an unthinking reaction of rage over being thwarted and exposed.

Though of course it will have the bonus effect of fooling some people, who will take their lies at face value, or suspect that there is "no smoke without fire", or lazily assume that "both sides are at fault".

Dana Rivers and Lauren Jeska, mentioned earlier in the thread are irrefutable proof of just how insanely murderous narcissistic rage can be. This really is not a "both sides need to calm down" situation.

The reaction to lgba existing has been terrifying. Lacking any sense of proportion, relentless, vitriolic and so strong. It seems worse than the hate directed at wpuk and others.

One of the things that is frequently brought up on The Mess We're In podcast is the Trumpian nature of transactivism's relationship with the truth. Here we have people who know they are being filmed and yet they are perfectly willing to tell the most brazen lies on camera. Evidence no longer matters.

I take issue with your last sentence. Evidence will always matter.

I see this so many times here.

As a dramatic flourish on a sensible post a pointless dramatic pose is struck.

Evidence doesn't matter

We are discussing the blatant lies. Why are you motivated to assert evidence doesn't matter at the end of that?

Does it make you feel better to accentuate drama?

Isn't it more useful but perhaps less emotionally satisfying to you to say, here's the truth and stop there instead?

This is a genuine question?

If you want evidence to matter why do you end your posts with a dramatic flourish saying that it doesn't?

What are you achieving? A bit of hopeless resignation? A sense of fatalistic hopelessness? Is that enjoyable?

I find it a bit ridiculous in the context of feminist conversation. I wonder why this happens here so much?

Maybe the thought is that it seems as though evidence doesn't matter when people are willing to behave so badly on camera.

The good thing is that ultimately evidence does matter.

DC has videoed his response to the backlash against The Closer.

It's worth a watch.

Spoiler: he's not backing down - far from it.

There's the case Chappelle is so rich he'll never need to work again, but that's not the point and we see it here Bread - his documentary (about something else entirely) has lost all chance of distribution and film festival screenings because of this and he's done nothing wrong.

All power to him. He has seen this for what it is and won't be silenced.

Not just a documentary about something else entirely, but a documentary about the murder of a black man by a police officer. This can’t get screened because predominantly white people are offended by jokes, which was the exact point Chappelle made in the show in the first place, about where he sees the issue. The reaction has proved his point.

@NotBadConsidering

Not just a documentary about something else entirely, but a documentary about the murder of a black man by a police officer. This can’t get screened because predominantly white people are offended by jokes, which was the exact point Chappelle made in the show in the first place, about where he sees the issue. The reaction has proved his point.

Exactly.

EsmeCannonball:
On the thread about the LGB Alliance conference a poster commented that the reason the LGBA draws so much ire is because its existence means that transactivists can no longer force-team LGB people. I think one of the reasons The Closer has pressed buttons is that transactivists are desperate to force-team black people and Chappelle has correctly identified the people who most benefit from gender ideology are those who already have power. He says that some people's hurt feelings matter more than actual black lives. He says that white men saying, 'I'm a woman now!' is about who gets to make the rules. This is one of the reasons transactivists are trying to shut this down. When Vito was chanting, 'I like Dave! Jokes are funny!' a white woman in the crowd started the non-sequitor chant of 'Black lives matter!' It is all sinister and totalitarian.

Yes! From this perspective, some of their behavior seems to make more sense.

Another perspective In “Material Girls,” Kathleen Stock wrote about what she called “immersion,” like when we get swept up in the emotions of a movie, even though we know it isn’t real. (I’m probably about to completely misrepresent what she actually wrote but this was my takeaway.) She also used “immersion” with reference to people like undercover agents, where they have to keep it up for long periods of time. I think she suggests that some TRAs are acting more in terms of something like this type of “immersion” rather than logic or reason, which is a possible explanation for their unreasonable and hostile responses to anything that interrupts or threatens to interrupt their ”immersion,” (a state where facts must not matter).

@Wildfart

One of the things that is frequently brought up on The Mess We're In podcast is the Trumpian nature of transactivism's relationship with the truth. Here we have people who know they are being filmed and yet they are perfectly willing to tell the most brazen lies on camera. Evidence no longer matters.

I take issue with your last sentence. Evidence will always matter.

I see this so many times here.

As a dramatic flourish on a sensible post a pointless dramatic pose is struck.

Evidence doesn't matter

We are discussing the blatant lies. Why are you motivated to assert evidence doesn't matter at the end of that?

Does it make you feel better to accentuate drama?

Isn't it more useful but perhaps less emotionally satisfying to you to say, here's the truth and stop there instead?

This is a genuine question?

If you want evidence to matter why do you end your posts with a dramatic flourish saying that it doesn't?

What are you achieving? A bit of hopeless resignation? A sense of fatalistic hopelessness? Is that enjoyable?

I find it a bit ridiculous in the context of feminist conversation. I wonder why this happens here so much?

@Wildfart

My reading of the final sentence is not that Esma believes evidence doesn’t matter. When I read it, it seems to me rather that there is an implied “to them” on the end. So the entire sentence would be “Evidence no longer matters to them.” And I think that’s true. For whatever reason, they are lying without shame.

@Kotatsu

Videos already removed - it's as though they don't want people to know about this...

Oh I've just watched them? Are they back?

I cannot imagine how upsetting and infuriating it must be to be assaulted at a protest and then see the media reporting blatant lies about what happened that casts you instead as aggressors.

It's laughable that these thugs call themselves anti-fascist when they're using the fascist playbook on how to create violence and lies.

The whole thing is utterly chilling.

What worries me more is that the American law system seems in places to be more captured than here, according to this article:

Thanks for posting Dave Chappelle’s response.
Will be interesting to see which way Netflix falls, as it would appear to me and my very uneducated view that Dave Chappell is a powerful voice in the black community so do they risk cancelling him and how that will be perceived in that community? Or do they stick with the trans community or even find a middle ground.

Oh and the above garbled post is not about the black community v trans community it is merely pondering which voice will be the most important to the media industry.

Gender theory in the Trial Court www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4384908-gender-theory-in-the-trial-court

I've just linked to the thread I started; it's not clear how many courts are captured and how far this influence goes in terms of actual law in practise, but it's concerning that the same gumpf that's causing the awful assaults on both these men is being included on courses for lawyers.

Within this worldview and in this context it seems as if evidence doesn't matter.

Could be seen as a rhetorical flourish, could also be a way to emphasise the underlying problem here, which is that we are dealing with a movement that is willing to use violence (break his stick) misrepresent (he's choking me) and manipulate false narratives (he's got a weapon) to shut down dissent. Media then colluded.

This video we are discussing is the evidence Esma alludes to. It doesn't matter because the evidence is being suppressed and manipulated to show a skewed and false narrative.

I don't think it's dramatic at all, actually.