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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Response from the home office; police recording of sex.

7 replies

Anontwentyone · 15/10/2021 07:50

The home office have responded to a petition requesting that crimes are recorded by sex not claimed gender.

The Government does not plan to require biological sex to be recorded across the criminal justice system in this way. Policy is being developed in certain areas of demographic recording.

Policy responsibility for managing suspects and offenders is split between the Home Office (role of police) and the Ministry of Justice (courts, prisons and probation).

Currently, the Home Office does not centrally mandate how an offender’s sex or gender identity must be recorded by police. It is for each individual police force to decide what information to record. However, Home Office officials are working with the police to promote a standardized approach to recording basic demographic characteristics of victims and suspects of crime. This should bring greater accuracy and consistency of the recording of sex and gender identity.

Any such changes to police recording should influence how Her Majesty’s Courts and Tribunals Service (HMCTS) records offenders, since magistrates and Crown Courts use data supplied by the police.

Her Majesty’s Prison and Probation Service (HMPPS) record the legally recognised gender of prisoners (or best available evidence where this is not known). The gender a prisoner identifies as is recorded in addition to the legally recognised gender, where this is different, which makes it clear that this is not the person’s legally recognised gender.

Officials have noted that ‘biological sex’ has not been defined in the petition. If ‘biological sex’ is defined in terms of anatomy, or chromosomes, then there would be both ethical and logistical challenges for the police or the HMPPS in determining this for every arrested suspect or prisoner. For instance, it would not be appropriate for the police or HMPPS to physically examine every suspect/prisoner in order to determine ‘biological sex’ if it had one of these meanings. Accordingly, there are no plans for the police or HMPPS to record the biological sex of prisoners.

Assuming that ‘biological sex’ is defined as the sex a person is assigned at birth, HMPPS’s position is as follows. Most people’s legal gender will remain the same as their sex as recorded at birth throughout their lives. The Gender Recognition Act 2004 allows transgender people who have (or have had) gender dysphoria, and intend to live in their acquired gender for the rest of their life, to change their legal gender. They can do this by obtaining a gender recognition certificate (GRC), which is in effect a replacement birth certificate. Section 9 of the Act states that:

“Where a full gender recognition certificate is issued to a person, the person’s gender becomes for all purposes the acquired gender (so that, if the acquired gender is the male gender, the person’s sex becomes that of a man and, if it is the female gender, the person’s sex becomes that of a woman).”

Where a prisoner has a GRC, HMPPS will continue to record their legal gender, in line with the law. HMPPS will continue to manage prisoners with GRCs according to the Ministry of Justice (MoJ) and HMPPS policy framework: ‘The Care and Management of Individuals who are Transgender’, which is available at assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/863610/transgender-pf.pdf.

Home Office

They've basically invoked gender ideology myth number 17 "to tell anyone's sex you'll need to do genital inspections" because you simply can't tell otherwise...

I'm also almost certain they're lying about sex and gender being recorded separately for prisoners, (which was not the concern of the petition in the first place, it was crime statistics generally). If sex and gender are both recorded why are we being forced to refer to convicted rapists as women? That is going by claimed "gender" and nothing else.

The reply is obnoxious, infuriating and reckless.

OP posts:
lady69 · 15/10/2021 07:54

I got that as well. Reeks of Stonewall. .

Blackandwhitehorse · 15/10/2021 08:10

The fact the phrase assigned at birth was used tells you everything you need to know.

However I can understand their response to some extent, the real issue is we are letting people legally change gender so this is what naturally follows.

McDuffy · 15/10/2021 08:11

Another thread here Smile

AIBU to think this Home Office response is a cop out? - to "Require sex of VATP & sexual offenders be recorded throughout justice system." www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4375385-AIBU-to-think-this-Home-Office-response-is-a-cop-out-to-Require-sex-of-VATP-sexual-offenders-be-recorded-throughout-justice-system

Gncq · 15/10/2021 08:13

Oh great glad it's on AIBU.

It's as though the petition was fobbed off onto the woke university intern. Why are we letting woke interns handle serious matters like this!

LivingLaVidaBabyShower · 15/10/2021 08:14

What a load of stonewall bollocks.

Assigned at birth tells you everything.

I'm embarassed for whoever wrote this response and hope to god it wasnt a woman "cervix haver"

PronounssheRa · 15/10/2021 08:17

AFAIK the home office are still members of the stonewall ponzi scheme

BettyFilous · 15/10/2021 08:25

I opened that email first thing and muttered “oh for fuck’s sake!” I thought it was pathetic that that this buck was passed to individual police forces - the MOJ should provide leadership and a national steer on this. The equivocation about biological sex would also be laughable if the impact wasn’t so serious. Utter nitwits!

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