Byline Times article really trying to link gender critical feminists to the far-right

[NonHypotheticalLurkingParent]

I saw this the other day. Heavily pushing Stonewall statistics on suicide and saying Transgender Trend is 'almost' akin to right-wing religious fundamentalism.

It reads as if the writer has been fed the right-wing narrative from TRA twitter activists/foxy kimono, and hasn't really been able to find any substantive links, but wrote the piece anyway.

Presumably the Communist Party is now in league with the Far-Right?

@Jaysmith71

Presumably the Communist Party is now in league with the Far-Right?

I, too, have a habit of wanting to see consistency and coherence.

I must break myself of this in order to be assimilated into the Brave New World (Order?).

I can't read anything that gets its info from Stonewall

I haven't read the article, nor do I have any intention of doing so, but I applaud The Times for publishing another aspect to the issue as they have shown themselves to be GC. It's only when people are presented with a wide range of opinions can they decide for themselves.

@Eyesofdisarray

I can't read anything that gets its info from Stonewall

I was really disappointed. I've been reading Byline Times for a while now, and am usually impressed with their fact-finding efforts, but using outdated facts from Stonewall without question - I'm presuming even the Byline Times editor wasn't too sure of them as they've not even linked to the citation.

Good point. It's all fuel to the fire, isn't it? People who are GC can present facts and figures; Stonewall and its allies have to rely on dodgy statistics and feelings.

@AlfonsoTheDinosaur

I haven't read the article, nor do I have any intention of doing so, but I applaud The Times for publishing another aspect to the issue as they have shown themselves to be GC. It's only when people are presented with a wide range of opinions can they decide for themselves.

I'll read anything tbh. I was interested to see the evidence - spoiler - there wasn't any.

I just don't care if my GC views are called far right, I know I'm not as do my friends and family. In the past few years my political views have been deemed loony left, metropolitan elite, brexiteer, racist, snowflake, extreme, conservative. The vast majority of people have a mix of views and don't fit whatever label/insult is hurled at them.

That's one of the points I was trying to make, albeit clumsily.

If there is a contentious issue I want both sides of the debate to put forward their arguments so that I can decide which side (if either) I agree with. The side that puts forward an argument that is based on evidence that I can verify tends to win. The side that argues feelings and questionable statistics that can't be independently verified doesn't.

The 'CEO' of Byline Times is one Peter Jukes (Marenghi-ish Twitter bio: 'Dramatist wrenched out of fiction by the fierce urgency of fact') who last week tweeted this gem: 'Biological determinism worries me. I say that as an Armenian Welsh English Londoner. But also as a human who had tonsils and appendix removed. When did we start getting defined by parts of our anatomy?'. Yes, tonsils are the new clownfish. He was taken to task for this idiocy by numerous feminists in the comments, but rather than actually listening to women, it seems instead he's doubling down and pushing the idea we're all some right-wing conspiracy. I've just looked at his recent Twitter timeline and fox-killer pops up a lot too.

Edit - that was in response to NonHypothetical.

That is useful information. Thanks, Ivy.

So women's rights to safety, privacy and dignity are now right wing and transphobic according to Stonewall. Nice to know. Tell that to the women prisoners raped In prison by male bodied prisoners identifying as women.

Transgender Trend is 'almost' akin to right-wing religious fundamentalism.

Because Right wing fundamentalism is a major force in U.K. politics?

@334bu

So women's rights to safety, privacy and dignity are now right wing and transphobic according to Stonewall. Nice to know. Tell that to the women prisoners raped In prison by male bodied prisoners identifying as women.

Let's cut it down to basics: All decent citizens are opposed to women's rights to safety, privacy and dignity where these are in conflict with the needs of anyone else.

@AlfonsoTheDinosaur

That's one of the points I was trying to make, albeit clumsily.

If there is a contentious issue I want both sides of the debate to put forward their arguments so that I can decide which side (if either) I agree with. The side that puts forward an argument that is based on evidence that I can verify tends to win. The side that argues feelings and questionable statistics that can't be independently verified doesn't.

I did get you, slightly slowly on my part and totally agree!

Ivy - wow, that twitter thread. He goes on to mention Angler fish, where the females absorb the males when mating and keep their testicals so look like a hermaphrodite species, but aren't. Not quite sure what he's saying by bringing them up as surely that means Angler fish are binary sexed, but the females are still females even with bollocks?!

Always remember with TAs and their fellow travellers that accusations are admissions

If fighting to maintain the hard won sex based rights of women and girls makes me a "right wing religious fundamentalist" then I can't help you.

It's all they have. Embarrassing, used to be quite the fan of Byline Times. Just another bunch of lefty misogynists.

Peter Jukes is a nightmare on ideologue

The Byline times is a wolf in sheep’s clothing

If Mr Jukes wants an answer to When did we start getting defined by parts of our anatomy? he needs to ask the people who push for odd language like “people with a cervix”, “people who menstruate” & “birthing people”. Because that is a far cruder (& grossly offensive) way of defining people by their anatomy than the simple sex binary that has ensured humans have not died out as a species.

@hamstersarse

Peter Jukes is a nightmare on ideologue

The Byline times is a wolf in sheep’s clothing

I agree. I am disappointed by The Times. I thought that the editor was acting in good faith but I see that he is not.

(Marenghi-ish Twitter bio: 'Dramatist wrenched out of fiction by the fierce urgency of fact')

Isn’t it just? 😂

There are a lot of shallow underlying assumtions and stupid conflations with this kind of thinking.

I saw a cartoon just before the most recent Canadian election which was basically suggesting that the Conservative party leader, who is fairly new, was making the party "alt-right". Which is crazy, even at their most Chicago-school moment under Harper they weren't really alt-right, and the new leader has in almost every way been trying to drag them back into Red Tory land.

I asked the person who had posted the cartoon what they meant by alt-right, with no answer, which is pretty typical in my experience. There seems to be very little underlying sense of what any of these terms, be it right vs left, conservative, progressive, etc, actually mean. They see them as more like a list of causes they support or oppose with no clear thread tying them together. They are thrown any time something doesn't fit into the little box because they don't understand why it was put there in the first place or whether that was ever a good choice. They don't have any sense that some issues could be supported or opposed from several different positions, or that some of these categories have significant things in common, because they don't really know what the categories mean.

I make myself follow people I don’t agree with on Twitter. Peter Jukes still makes me angry even though I should in theory warm to someone and be able to ‘accept difference’….because that is my intention. But with him, I just can’t!

The guy is classic left wing virtue signalling misogynist and actually thinks he’s a superior being

He excelled himself again yesterday. I can't do the full thing justice, but this tweet in particular stood out for me as indicating that he really doesn't understand what he's talking about:
twitter.com/peterjukes/status/1444730478477578249