Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Being asked to wear a badge

49 replies

grapejuice14 · 04/09/2021 13:33

Hi all

I attend a group twice a week that also runs an LGBT+ night. Due to concerns of misgendering, we have been asked to wear a badge with our pronouns on any night we attend as some of the LGBT+ group attend the other nights as well and have prompted a policy etc being brought in about pronouns.

Obviously I don't want to leave the group as it is one of the things that has brought me out of quite a bad period of mental health but I also don't want to have to out myself as GC and be kicked out.

Any advice would be really appreciated as to how I can approach this and still feel okay with attending the other nights. Thank you!

OP posts:
2020in2020 · 04/09/2021 13:34

I’ve read this exact post before I am sure?

Original poster
grapejuice14 · 04/09/2021 13:37

I tried to post and it said error because it said I had to use an existing username, so I reposted. It may have gone through twice sorry!

OP posts:
somethinginoffensive · 04/09/2021 13:41

Asked to wear a badge or obliged to wear a badge?

I would suggest just not putting a pronoun badge on. If you don't want to raise the issue directly, just reply that you don't feel comfortable wearing one at the moment. That could be for any reason.

HalfShrunkMoreToGo · 04/09/2021 13:43

I'd just write my name on it.

If anyone asks, just advice them to refer to you by your name rather than pronoun.

I can't think of any scenario where you would need to use a pronoun if you have a name.

  • she was stood by the table/Jane was stood by the table
  • I hate her she's mean/ I hate Jane, Jane's mean.
  • it's here's/ it's Jane's
LumpySpacedPrincess · 04/09/2021 13:46

Just say no thank you with a smile.

Original poster
grapejuice14 · 04/09/2021 13:47

Asked to wear a badge but have also said in the message that if you're uncomfortable to either wear a they/them or an ask me. So not sure how much it's going to be pushed, if the box will be left out or if someone will be overseeing it etc. I just don't want to wear a badge full stop and I feel ask me may open a can of worms I'm not ready for yet.

OP posts:
Fitt · 04/09/2021 13:53

I would not wear a badge for the same reason I don't wear a brooch, they make holes in my clothes, end up in the washing machine (and I'm not 12).

somethinginoffensive · 04/09/2021 13:54

"I don't feel comfortable wearing a badge".

"Okay, they/them or ask me"

"I don't feel comfortable wearing a badge".

And repeat if needed.

FreddyKreugersWife · 04/09/2021 13:55

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

RobinWoodPrinceofLeaves · 04/09/2021 13:57

I’d say “I’d rather not”, but if you did, “them/it” or “he/she” - also there was an actor from Love Simon (Keiynan Lonsdale) who (seriously) said his pronoun was “tree” (might make people realise the ridiculousness)

AnyOldPrion · 04/09/2021 14:05

It’d start from a position of “I’m not comfortable wearing a badge, or discussing my reasons” and take it from there.

If they are very insistent, perhaps ask if it’s possible to have separate sessions?

What a horrible problem, OP. The pressure to wear a badge sounds very unfair.

CuriousaboutSamphire · 04/09/2021 14:08

I put my name on mine.

As others have said, I was in the room, in front of the people talking. Pronouns just wouldn't be required ... and would be 'outing' in oh so many ways, if insisted upon.

Initially I was glared at. Then others also put their names on their badges, and continued to do so week after week.

Quiet revolutions 🙂

CharlieParley · 04/09/2021 14:09

It should be enough to say a polite but firm "no thank you". If anyone pushes, I would quote the Yogyakarta Principle 6f (Principle 6 is all about LGBT people's right to privacy).

6f states:

Ensure the right of all persons ordinarily to choose when, to whom and how to disclose information pertaining to their sexual orientation or gender identity, and protect all persons from arbitrary or unwanted disclosure, or threat of disclosure of such information by others.

Then follow up with I don't feel comfortable making these disclosures about myself and you should not be insisting that I do so.

That way you don't have to have a belief vs disbelief discussion, but can simply decline to participate in the mandatory pronoun badge drive.

HalfShrunkMoreToGo · 04/09/2021 14:14

Didn't realise I'd requested a grammar lesson @FreddyKreugersWife.

Has your correction made any meaningful difference to the post I made? Do you believe that anyone was struggling to understand what I had written?

PankhurstConnection · 04/09/2021 14:17

@CuriousaboutSamphire

I put my name on mine.

As others have said, I was in the room, in front of the people talking. Pronouns just wouldn't be required ... and would be 'outing' in oh so many ways, if insisted upon.

Initially I was glared at. Then others also put their names on their badges, and continued to do so week after week.

Quiet revolutions 🙂

I like this approach a lot.
thirdfiddle · 04/09/2021 14:17

It's pointless, people will forget/not bother/rebel. Any repetitive action with dubious benefit to anyone, people forget very quickly. They don't even manage to keep name badges on for the duration of a one day conference in my experience.

If you don't want to make a stand, you could if pushed pick up a they/them at the desk then lose it. Perhaps you're wearing a nice top that doesn't want holes in. I would probably try a cheery 'no thanks' at least, you might well take others with you and speed up the demise of the tiresome initiative. You don't want people to 'ask you', you just don't care what pronouns people use.

Deliriumoftheendless · 04/09/2021 14:25

Name sounds a really good way of going about it.

You presumably do wish to be referred to by your name so there’s nothing wrong with that. If anyone asks how they should refer to you you can say “by my name.”

In conversation I would prefer people to say “I agree with Del” over “I agree with her.” (Which her? Me or one of the other hers? It’s like at soft play when a kid wails muuuuum and every woman in the place looks round.)

WorkingItOutAsIGo · 04/09/2021 14:28

I do think the best form of defence is attack so outwoking them as PP suggests by making them realise theirs is against the Yogyakarta Principles and deeply triggering.

plodalong12 · 04/09/2021 14:34

Badge/less

PankhurstConnection · 04/09/2021 14:34

@CharlieParley

It should be enough to say a polite but firm "no thank you". If anyone pushes, I would quote the Yogyakarta Principle 6f (Principle 6 is all about LGBT people's right to privacy).

6f states:

Ensure the right of all persons ordinarily to choose when, to whom and how to disclose information pertaining to their sexual orientation or gender identity, and protect all persons from arbitrary or unwanted disclosure, or threat of disclosure of such information by others.

Then follow up with I don't feel comfortable making these disclosures about myself and you should not be insisting that I do so.

That way you don't have to have a belief vs disbelief discussion, but can simply decline to participate in the mandatory pronoun badge drive.

In the event, this is likely what I would do as Charley has drummed it into me Grin
Chloemol · 04/09/2021 14:34

I would wear a badge with my name on, and that’s what they can call me

So instead of saying Chloemol said she went to xxx yesterday they can just say Chloemol went to xxx yesterday and have to think a bit more about using my name rather than he/she/they or whatever

nauticant · 04/09/2021 14:39

I'd say that because my pronouns are "fuck" and "off" then wearing them on a badge might lead to misunderstanding and/or offence.

Instead of my flippancy OP, CharlieParley's invocation of the Yogyakarta Principles looks like a good way to go.

Original poster
grapejuice14 · 04/09/2021 14:42

Yes definitely will use the right to privacy that seems like a good way to go thank you. The funny thing is, I do actually identify within the community and it's those forcing the issue of pronouns who are making me feel unwelcome at the LGBT+ nights!

OP posts:
Original poster
grapejuice14 · 04/09/2021 14:44

Someone has been much braver than me within the group and is saying they will use names but is not going to wear a badge and it's all kicked off so at least I know I'm not alone! Hopefully they'll decide against the whole badge idea for a quiet life but I'm not convinced when a select few are being so vocal.

OP posts:
PaleBlueMoonlight · 04/09/2021 14:47

I would just say “no thanks” or “no I don’t want to, thanks”

I absolutely will not participate in a practice that is entirely aimed at legitimising the re-purposing of pronouns to refer to gender identity instead of to sex.

For the vast majority of people, whether or not transgender, sex based pronouns are fine (whether it is their actually sex or because it is clear they are trying to live as an archetype of the opposite sex) and obvious. If there is someone who doesn’t want to use sex based pronouns and/or is androgynous in appearance, they are at liberty to wear a badge asking people to use different pronouns or to make it clear what the correct (sex-based) pronouns would be, if it is annoying having to correct people. In a group where gender ideology is popular, such badges may be more prevalent. There is no reason at all for anyone else to wear badges and to require people to is detrimental to woman as it seeks to reify the concept of gender identity as the basis of social categorisation, in place of sex, while sneakily trying to pretend that it is doing no such thing.