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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

School of sexuality Education

37 replies

happydappy2 · 01/09/2021 16:44

Oh dear-just had an email from my Childs school & the above org are delivering sex ed-having looked on their website a 6th form student has written "“I really like how the workshop remained inclusive and it was acknowledged that not all people with boobs/vaginas are female or that penis=male.”

Anyone had any dealings with with organisation please? Seems a very odd message to deliver to school children...

OP posts:
anaily · 12/09/2021 22:47

Why can't it be both.

NiceGerbil · 12/09/2021 23:09

You want the terms male and female to mean both sex and gender?

The terms woman man girl boy have in this country been redefined by loads of orgs businesses etc to mean gender not sex.

Why do the words female male need to be redefined as well?

Apart from the fact this student was taught that female male mean gender. So your suggestion doesn't really address the point.

Wont that be very confusing? To have it meaning both.

anaily · 12/09/2021 23:33

I don't find it confusing, there are people where their sex and gender are in harmony, the are people where the is a mismatch so they describe it in a way that is comfortable for them, that takes nothing away from me. I understand that you feel that it does strip you of your identity when someone else says they are not their sex.

NiceGerbil · 13/09/2021 00:03

If both sex and gender mean internal gender identity then how can there be a mismatch? They are the same.

NiceGerbil · 13/09/2021 00:04

Do you really not see how teaching children that sex means gender identity is a bit of a problem? It leaves no words for sex. (For humans at least. Not sure how it works with animals).

Blibbyblobby · 13/09/2021 00:38

@anaily

I don't find it confusing, there are people where their sex and gender are in harmony, the are people where the is a mismatch so they describe it in a way that is comfortable for them, that takes nothing away from me. I understand that you feel that it does strip you of your identity when someone else says they are not their sex.
there are people where their sex and gender are in harmony, the are people where the is a mismatch

What is sex?

What is gender?

When you say sex and gender are in harmony or a mismatch, what exactly do you mean?

To be clear, I am not asking because I am somehow confused, don't understand or have not heard the concepts before. I am fully aware of them, aware in fact of many different and often contradicting explanations, and I know what I think.

Right now, I'm interested in what you think.

I will be honest, I am asking because I suspect there will be some inconsistencies in your thinking, but I don't want to jump in and make assumptions without knowing exactly what you understand these things to be and how they relate to each other, so rather than assume I know what you think I'm asking you to explain in your own words.

I understand that you feel that it does strip you of your identity when someone else says they are not their sex.

Ah, I think you may misunderstand here. Certainly for myself, I don't feel stripped of my identity because someone says they are not their sex.

I do, however, feel stripped of the name that my group, the female bodied, have used for centuries, the name that we fought for rights under and the name that our single sex rights, opportunities and protections were given under, and therefore the rights, opportunities and protections themselves . Because when a male person claims they must be counted and included as Woman or Female, entirely interchangeable with someone who has lived from birth in a female body and experienced the implications of having that body in this society, they are making the name Woman or Female cover a different group than the one it has historically meant, and that leaves that original group nameless.

Do you think that female people - to be clear, female bodied people, the group that has suffered and continues to suffer sexism and oppression because of their bodies - should be allowed a name?

And I also feel misgendered, because when that male person claims we are both Women, she is making a statement that womanhood is a state of mind not a fact of the body. But while that may be true for her that is not how I experience womanhood. So she is imposing her own, male view of my identify over my own.

Do you think that a male person's belief about a female person should have more authority than that female person's own self-knowledge?

NiceGerbil · 13/09/2021 01:21

Anaily has said no probs with teaching children that sex = gender identity.

This means there can be no difference in sex and gender identity as they are the same- gender identity.

Also disagree that there are any issues with leaving no words for biological sex.

The words man woman girl boy have in many orgs etc etc been redefined to mean gender ID but not sex.

If the words male female are redefined there's no words to describe / group something in humans that has so many useful / vital applications. To leave the two sexes with no words to differentiate them would cause massive issues for both sexes.

timeisnotaline · 13/09/2021 01:39

What a relief the adults when looking into it recognised the material is misleading!

OhHolyJesus · 26/05/2022 15:13

Sharing this here OP - there appears to be a new tactic of getting 'sex ed' books into school libraries. Pop and Ollie did similar I believe...

From the School of Sexuality:

"We're an award-winning relationships and sex education charity based in the UK. We provide in-school workshops on topics such as consent, sexual health, porn, positive relationships and more. We believe that everyone deserves inclusive and comprehensive relationships and sex education.
Last September, we published Sex Ed: An Inclusive Teenage Guide to Sex and Relationships. Sex Ed is positive, practical and empowering guide for teenagers, tackling sex and relationships in an accessible and non-judgemental way. Aimed at secondary school age teens and above, Sex Ed draws on our experience working with young people every day. It includes:
How to build positive relationships;
Facts about our bodies and how they change as we grow up;
What is 'consent' and how does it apply in online contexts;
How to build inclusive environments;
Being safe online.
We've included answers to the questions we get asked most frequently and we've debunked the myths we hear the most. And it’s not just for teens! Sex Ed contains guidance pages for teachers, parents and carers, including:
How you can use the book to plan your lessons;
How to manage sensitive conversations with teens;
Myths and misconceptions to look out for in the RSE classroom.
Our aim is for all UK secondary schools to have a copy of Sex Ed: An Inclusive Teenage Guide to Sex and Relationships in their library. This is a MASSIVE target so we’re starting by crowdfunding for 1000 schools to have a copy heading their way by the end of 2022!
With your help, we can move one step closer to providing teenagers with the comprehensive sex and relationship education they deserve.
The book has been Longlisted for the School Library Association's 'Information Book Award' 2022. Shortlist to be announced in June."
www.gofundme.com/f/ne497p

happydappy2 · 26/05/2022 16:41

ohHolyJesus are you able to post again with different wording perhaps? I have grave concerns about this organisation

OP posts:
OhHolyJesus · 27/05/2022 12:26

happydappy2 · 26/05/2022 16:41

ohHolyJesus are you able to post again with different wording perhaps? I have grave concerns about this organisation

If you search for school of sexuality and gofundme you will find what I was referring to - I suspect this thread and others mentioning the family sex show and related orgs is being watched...

ThinkingaboutLangClegosaurus · 28/05/2022 11:49

Even in the 1950s and 60s children weren't actually taught in school that liking "boys' clothes" made you a boy, or liking "girls' toys" made you a girl! it was just convention, which was already dying out by then. It was dead and buried by the end of the 70s, but gender ideologists have revived the stereotypes and dignified them with the name 'gender'.

Not what anyone could call progress.

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