Celebrated indigenous Canadian artist disclosed as fake - familiar territory

[Mulletsaremisunderstood]

Story in the times today about a white Canadian man who claimed to be indigenous to bolster his art career. It's a horrible story about a deluded man who faked his way into other people's identity.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/fdd7a15e-f6be-11eb-8f01-2c678acbb979?shareToken=bf650a795b5996c97566edf8606f9957

Everyone can see that this is heinous and ridiculous. Yet nobody can admit that appropriating women's experience is just as offensive.

These quotes really resonated:

“I had certainly never heard of a non-native person appropriating that experience,” Pedri-Spade said. “It’s like a heinous crime in our neck of the woods.

Bob Chamberlin, the former indigenous chief in British Columbia, said that he was concerned to see “self-identified folks playing roles in defining how society may view our people’s struggle”.

Veldon Coburn, an indigenous professor at the University of Ottawa, said that most of those who appropriated indigenous ancestry were motivated by financial gain or career advancement “by piggy-backing on equity programmes for under-represented groups.”

He said that some “fetishise indigenous people to such an extent that they create a whole persona for themselves in which they cosplay being indigenous”.

But if you stop and think about how much effort would be involved, possibly years of constructing a persona and inhabiting it, then it's clear that no one would go to so much trouble.

Which means the article must be fake news. The good thing about reaching this conclusion is that it helps in thinking the world is less complex than it would otherwise be. Who wants the mental load of acknowledging such complexity?

I'm always really uncomfortable conflating racial appropriation to sex appropriation. I can't put my words together fully right now to explain properly, beyond there being an overlap of discrimination to contend with therein.

Not only have native Canadian's suffered horrendously at the hands of the powers that be, lands taken, waters polluted, citizens slaughtered etc, etc, but the women in those races also suffer a further level of discrimination beyond my experience. Nobody cares about all of the missing native women, or DV in the communities etc.

I'm not expressing myself well, but it feels somehow incomparable to me.

Chickenyhead yes and women have been oppressed by men for centuries!

I'm simply pointing out that when this happens to any other group it is acknowledged for what it is, a farce.

There was a similar case a couple of years ago, but in that case it was a white man calling himself a native Canadian woman. It was quite amusing watching themselves fall over with the horror at him pretending to be native Canadian while studiously going along with the pretending to be a woman.

Made the whole thing just seem performative, really. Why should I believe anyone discussing it had any real principles, rather than it just being a squabble in whatever literary community it was?

Not without precedent:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_Owl

@Mulletsaremisunderstood

Chickenyhead yes and women have been oppressed by men for centuries!

I'm simply pointing out that when this happens to any other group it is acknowledged for what it is, a farce.

I see the parallels definitely.

Perhaps on the sliding scale of appropriation, the fact that the gender ideology is so easily changing the laws to which we are all subject, makes it stand out on a global scale.

Not just one crazy, exploitative, white man, but an entire society putting women out of the category of woman. Taking away rights fought for and finally only gained in the last century. Undone in a click of male fingers privilege.

I suspect this story could resonate quite strongly with that Elizabeth Warren woman

I can understand Chickenyhead what you mean about false comparisons. I'm not trying to assert which is worse or more abhorrent.

I just think it's really important to bring to people's attention every-time to this type of appropriation, and compare the responses by media, the general public.

I think it is a really useful way to point out the blatant hypocrisy, with the obvious outrage at one and the compete silence at the other.

*actually instead of silence, I should have said fawning and celebration.

[quote Jaysmith71]Not without precedent:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_Owl[/quote]
See also Chief Buffalo Child Long Lance

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chief_Buffalo_Child_Long_Lance

It’s fairly interesting.

Well that does sound familiar.

@Mulletsaremisunderstood

*actually instead of silence, I should have said fawning and celebration.

And that's the problem. We are half of the population. That must mean something.

This is why everything is being done secretly. Because we are only manageable if we keep priorising men.

'I identify as having a disability' - discovered to be in reasonably good health - faker can expect to be reviled.

'I identify as belonging to a minority group' - discovered to be white - faker can expect to be reviled.

'I identify as being a woman' - known all along to be male - anyone mentioning this can expect to be reviled.

@nauticant

But if you stop and think about how much effort would be involved, possibly years of constructing a persona and inhabiting it, then it's clear that no one would go to so much trouble.

Which means the article must be fake news. The good thing about reaching this conclusion is that it helps in thinking the world is less complex than it would otherwise be. Who wants the mental load of acknowledging such complexity?

Errr... Rachel Dolezal? Not to mention "Gray Owl" to which Jaysmith 71 refers.

Sorry, should have written 'to whom' in my reply to nauticant.

I totally understand why plenty of people are uncomfy with this sort of parallel.

Personally I think the arguments about self ID stand on their own.

I keep seeing that its because of the particular horrific things that were done to various groups. And that this parallel somehow minimises those atrocities.
Of course those histories and current struggled should and need to be known, discussed, not forgotten or minimised.

Not aimed at the pp this is general point because it feels like there's a subtext of. That's not right because women haven't had things as bad as that.

I don't know if it's because of
The way that societies everywhere are not interested/ play down things to do with women

Or not considering the reality of women now and through history around the world.

Just s few things-

Here we used to be property of our father then our husband. Around the world whether legally or culturally we still are.

Women and girls have been and still are traded for work or sex.

Marital rape only made illegal here early 90s, imagine is still legal in some places.

Some countries law allows for death penalty if raped (seen as adultery).

Mass rape common in war/ unrest.

Things related to reproduction variously. Forced birth, forced abortion, forced sterilisation. Various consequences for pregnancy when not supposed to/ not pregnant when supposed to.

Girls schools being bombed/ burnt down as belief they shouldn't be educated.

Women not being allowed to work in various circs meaning forced dependence.

Etc etc.

And through history I mean horrific in various places at various times.

Right now the taleban are making big gains on territory in Afghanistan. We all know what that means for women and girls there. They will be property. Not allowed to work. Doubt school. Must abide by rules on clothes. Etc etc.

I'm not saying it's a competition I hate that stuff. It's all awful and different things done.

Also I personally don't like drawing these parallels but that is just me I don't think others could stop or anything.

This is about my thoughts on the point that this sort of thing shouldn't be compared because it fails to understand how bad other things were.

I don't agree though. They're all awful. But the global oppression of women and girls though history and now. 51% of the population and for as long as we know. Albeit fluctuating due to religious/ political change.

It's massive and awful. And it's not s competition. But the idea it minimises other historical oppression around the world by drawing a parallel is just not ok to me.

I listened to a programme on radio four a while back about efforts to improve access to higher education for people with indigenous background in Brazil being undermined by people jumping on the bandwagon and claiming a heritage they don't have to avail themselves of the grants available. It got really complicated as they were trying to ascertain people's blood lines, eg would one grandparent be enough to qualify?
I think there are always people who will take advantage of financial assistance on offer if they can find a way to do it. Adopting victim status is a good way if you are so inclined.
That said, there is also a romantic appeal to adopting a new persona of indigenous culture, and living an attractive unconventional lifestyle - Grey Owl was not all bad, he was a celebrated conservationist at a time when no one else was interested, when big game hunting was a popular hobby among the wealthy he got to meet the Royals and broadcast from Buckingham palace.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-24127514