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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Nehanda Update: [Women are physically weaker.] Weaker doesn't mean less valuable.

58 replies

EmbarrassingAdmissions · 21/07/2021 21:01

Good discussion in her comments, including this from Salve Vagina:

This is a really great observation. The idea that physical strength equals social worth is so misogynist, but it's an idea so many of us [internalise] from childhood. And something deeply rooted like that is often very hard to even see in yourself, let alone to challenge and change.

twitter.com/NehandaMusic/status/1417570665331404803

She was mentioned on this 2020 thread in which she first her had reconsideration of her previous position about gender ideology:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/a3844928-Billy-Bragg?msgid=94899296#94899296

OP posts:
EmbarrassingAdmissions · 22/07/2021 17:00

@UsedUpUsername

Civilisation is especially precious for women, I feel, and that shouldn't be forgotten or underestimated

It’s definitely taken for granted. Hope I never see the consequences of this in my lifetime. What is it they say? Weak men create hard times?

I hope that I'm not paraphrasing her horribly but at a recent talk about her book, Helen Joyce was entirely clear-eyed about the fact that when all This is sorted it will be because men did it (insert your own air quotes around that).

Men will watch the chaos, nod along, something happens, and they will declare, This is all nonsense. Where were the feminists? Well, the women were using the wrong arguments and wrong tone. This is what will happen now. (I paraphrase.)

And it will be fixed. Because men did it. And, strategically, it will have to be recorded that way - because what is the prize here? No more inappropriate medicalisation of children? Freedom of thought and speech?

Galling undoubtedly. But if Weak men create hard times and men and the male-centered laws are creating these times…

OP posts:
ScreamingMeMe · 22/07/2021 17:39

I think the wokeyblokeys who harrange GC women are the epitome of "weak men".

Novelusername · 22/07/2021 18:21

I remember getting into an argument once with a woman online because she was offended by me saying that men are generally stronger than women. I can't remember the details, it wasn't trans related, but she seemed to think I was making women out to be victims. I can't help but think these women have never done any kinds of sport, and haven't been physically assaulted by a man, otherwise the strength difference would become immediately clear. When I was attacked on the street, the man was only around the same height as me and slim built, but I couldn't break free, and found it difficult to fight back. Before the gyms closed, I would lift weights several times a week, and after a few years of training I was lifting more than the skinny, beginner men, but that was it, with any other men there would be no competition. Certain women just don't want to think about this reality, but it permeates every aspect of our lives - it's why women are told to get taxis and walk with their keys between their fingers when out at night, whilst men don't fear potential attacks from women in the same way. I used to be carefree about such things myself, walking home after dark on my own because it didn't want to live in fear, wanted to feel untouchable. Sadly, the reality is that women are more vulnerable on account of their relative strength to men.

I find there's lots of contradictions on this topic. Certain men also get off on women struggling physically, I notice - when I'm struggling to carry heavy food shopping, or if I was lifting to my max in the gym, you'd get blokes staring and smirking, like it made them feel big to look down on a woman pushing herself and still only managing to lift a fraction of what they could. I think this thrill is apparent in young boys who enjoy beating girls at sports, and unfortunately some men don't grow out of it. Ironically, a lot of traditional 'women's work' is very physical, such as doing laundry by hand, food shopping, house cleaning and carrying around children. Strange then, that rather than it being chivalrous to offer to help with these tasks, it's more customary to hold open a door or a chair, objects that are perfectly light and easy to manoeuvre - it seems to be all about drawing attention to the man and his kind gesture, rather actually being in any way useful (I'm not the kind of woman who would get arsey about these things, but I do find them odd). The whole of civilization is arranged around the differences between our sexed bodies. I suppose the rejection of the facts of our sexed physical differences by women comes from seeing that this organisation of civilization has put women in less valued roles. It seems like they see accepting the facts of strength differences is acceptance of women's inferiority in society. We don't need to compete with men physically though, in order to be successful.

Novelusername · 22/07/2021 19:31

[quote FlyPassed]Nehanda is fab. Here she is on the Plebity podcast

[/quote] Just watched this. Nehanda needs to get her own podcast, she was absolutely great in this, so likeable and I could listen to her talk all day.
DoctorTwo · 22/07/2021 20:06

Nehanda's mum follows me on twitter. Why? No idea, but her daughter is great. Definitely not afraid to speak her mind.

ScreamingMeMe · 22/07/2021 20:24

@DoctorTwo

Nehanda's mum follows me on twitter. Why? No idea, but her daughter is great. Definitely not afraid to speak her mind.
Oh wow what's she like?
PearPickingPorky · 23/07/2021 08:11

Well, men do value the reproductive power - doesn't follow that they have to respect the beings that have it. They just need to be able to control them.

God, yes.

I haven't finished the thread yet (it's a fantastic thread) but this is very en pointe.

ErrolTheDragon · 23/07/2021 08:16

@Beowulfa

I read a lot of science fiction in my teens. I remember one Arthur C Clarke novel in which he predicted space ships would end up being crewed by women, as muscle strength has no advantage in zero gravity, and being smaller meant less oxygen consumption. He also arguably predicted GPS and the internet....
Going back to this for a minute, thinking about Wally Funk and the Mercury 13 - well, Funk didn't get to be the first on the moon but she's now the oldest person to go into space.

Wally Funk will get to space www.mumsnet.com/Talk/feminism/4286140-wally-funk-will-get-to-space

(Of course the first British astronaut was female)

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