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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Grauniad retweet an Observer review of Helen Joyce's books and Kathleen Stock's

30 replies

bellinisurge · 18/07/2021 11:34

twitter.com/guardianbooks/status/1416704817045524480?s=21

Well well well. Seeing the writing on the wall, are we?

OP posts:
BernardBlackMissesLangCleg · 18/07/2021 17:44

this quote from Joyce's book really spoke to me

Body-denialism also offers young women a way to supress the rage and shame that they can feel at being physically weaker than men, and vulnerable to rape

I've lived with my female body for a long time now and am pretty reconciled to the good and bad things it's brought me, but yes, I did feel that shame and rage as a young teenager.

female bodies are real, and they convey real challenges to their occupants

lanadelgrey · 18/07/2021 18:17

Rather like Jess Philips interview yesterday - it’s the Overton window being inched open. It’s not great but as HJ and KS both say it’s there. It might be interesting to buy both from the Guardian Bookshop - stats of bestsellers on their site will be noted and while editors are not directed to follow such things explicitly, they will take note

transdimensional · 18/07/2021 18:27

It's a very cautious review, so when one tweeter responded that it was ridiculous, I wasn't sure whether they were doing so from a feminist or a TRA standpoint.
But reading between the lines I think GH is sympathetic to at least some of the arguments that the books make and that she doesn't class herself among the people who want to throw the books across the room.
At any rate the TRAs will not be happy with these reviews and therefore, as lanadelgrey said above, "it's the Overton window being inched open".
And the American TRA Guardian contributors will be furious that the books are available from the Guardian bookshop and are probably already drawing up a petition against that.

R0wantrees · 18/07/2021 19:03

How Hinsliff could read could read the 'Back in the Box' chapter of Joyce's book, which clearly and logically sets out how regressive and sexist trans ideology is, and then write a review like that is mind boggling.

Many women had a similar reaction to Hinsliff's article that she wrote after the first WPUK Oxford meeting in 2018,
www.theguardian.com/world/2018/may/10/the-gender-recognition-act-is-controversial-can-a-path-to-common-ground-be-found

Also to her 2020 article about the issues within the Labour Party,
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/15/trans-rights-labour-leadership-candidates

There is a longstanding pattern.

Mulletsaremisunderstood · 19/07/2021 14:31

@CardinalLolzy

"As the former Olympic swimmer Sharron Davies, vilified for arguing that trans athletes shouldn’t compete in female sporting categories"

Why why why has "trans" become shorthand for "trans women"? Ffs of course trans people should compete in female sports... if they're female!

All this noise about inclusivity and trans men get left behind and forgotten about every time.

Yes, it's almost as if they know who the biological women are all along. And of course they are bottom of the pile, an afterthought.

Same old misogynistic shite.

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