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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Sky Brown - Britain's youngest Olympian (13)

35 replies

FlyPassed · 02/07/2021 21:20

Wow! Well done and best of luck, Sky! What an inspiration.

'But the main group Brown is hoping to win over is other young girls who may think the sport is not for them. “If you go to the skatepark it’s mostly boys there. Now there’s more and more girls there, which is cool, but it’s usually mostly boys. And I feel like sometimes girls are scared to be the only girl and they’re scared to be judged by the boys.

“But I feel like watching the Olympics, seeing how many girls are doing the sport and how good [they are], they’re gonna really want to [try it], which I’m really happy about.”'

www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/jul/01/skateboarder-sky-brown-to-become-youngest-british-summer-olympian

OP posts:
OneEpisode · 02/07/2021 21:26

I’m sure I read this on the other board? Why did this one get moved?

GromblesofGrimbledon · 02/07/2021 21:29

Why is this on the sex and gender debate board ...

FlyPassed · 02/07/2021 21:29

I posted it here - it didn't occur to me to look at the other board, i prefer it here!

OP posts:
GromblesofGrimbledon · 02/07/2021 21:30

@FlyPassed

I posted it here - it didn't occur to me to look at the other board, i prefer it here!

Oh good on you then! I thought it had been squirrelled away where it shouldn't be.

It is nice here. The inhabitants make it cosy.

FloralBunting · 02/07/2021 21:42

I'd always be happier in the garden where we know what reality is, than the palace pretending we can't see the Emperor's knackers.

Well done to both girls. That enthusiasm is a tonic!

DaisiesandButtercups · 02/07/2021 21:45

Fantastic news!! I look forward to watching Sky in the Olympics with my own daughters.

Thanks for posting here OP, I wouldn’t have seen it otherwise.

Ekofisk · 02/07/2021 21:50

She’s a complete tough nut. What a great role model for girls rejecting feminine stereotypes.

GromblesofGrimbledon · 02/07/2021 21:56

Lovely stuff! Grin

Thanks for drawing attention to this girl. She's fab!

Iggi999 · 02/07/2021 22:05

It is about sex and gender though - a young girl talking about judgement from boys based on doing a stereotypically "boy" activity is all about gender isn't it.

Wanttocry · 02/07/2021 22:08

Slightly missing the point I know, but I didn’t realise skate boarding was an Olympic sport, is that new? Will it work in a similar way to the half pipe snowboarding in the Winter Olympics, I always enjoy watching that.

FloralBunting · 02/07/2021 22:19

There isn't any genuinely feminist topic that doesn't touch on sex or gendered boxes. I dunno what the other lot are talking about if it's not sex or gender related, tbh.

Perhaps they're trying to work out why the generally bigger, stronger humans seem to be a bit aggy towards each other and the generally smaller, weaker humans and putting it down to wizardry.

FloralBunting · 02/07/2021 22:21

I actually love the Winter Olympics for the snowboarding stuff. I am quite keen to see how the skateboarding will be set up.

TinselAngel · 02/07/2021 22:36

I'm not sure how I feel about this. It was very bad when the top female gymnasts were her age.

MrGHardy · 02/07/2021 23:47

How is this legal? In gymnastics they have a minimum age, though I guess that also has to do with flexibility and exploitation. But still, it seems odd a child can perform professionally. In Germany there was quite a debate when the Bundesliga recently started to allow 16 year olds to play.

toffeebutterpopcorn · 03/07/2021 11:40

Nadia Comăneci was 14. There was another gymnast from Romania who started competing about the same age (I forget her name but I saw her in the 40s (?)- up against the young ‘uns in an exhibition)

trancepants · 03/07/2021 12:53

I low key love her but I also have reservations based on her age and worries about safety and exploitation. For one, has anyone seen the video that was released last year of her fall? It was filmed, edited and designed by her parents. It shows footage of her skateboarding leading up to her fall, the part where she didn't make the jump between verts. Then it goes into slow-mo as she starts to fall, the panic of the person filming as the shot goes askew as they clearly run to her. Then it switched to ambulance noises and clips of stills of the ambulance/hospital. Then the video ends with Sky, a child in a hospital bed recovering from severe injuries, doing what amounts to a piece of professional, scripted presenting, outlining her injuries and how her helmet saved her and how she's be back skating asap.

It made me extremely, extremely uncomfortable to watch. While obviously the accident itself wasn't staged, her parents still worked hard to stage how it was released and create a narrative around it. And for for years and years, Sky has been skating without any safety gear and her parents have been deleting comments from anyone who questioned her lack of a helmet. So it all just comes across as so very, very false. I suspect the main reason she had a helmet on at that point in her training is because helmets are mandatory for the Olympics. Up until that point, her parents had very much being promoting an extreme sport to girls (and all children) as one they should do without safety gear. Because while they weren't explicitly saying 'don't wear helmets' little girls seeing this amazing athlete, doing her thing without gear, with her hair flowing in the wind, would have wanted to copy her.

I also question the wisdom of having anyone, especially a child, work on the kind of vert jump she was doing without crash mats between the verts. I would respect her parents so much more if they actually came out and acknowledged that they had been lax about safety before but that would change now. They still have so many promotional videos of Sky out there with no safety gear. If that was me, I'd be retroactively adding disclaimers on those videos to state they were before her accident and that they recommend safety gear to anyone she inspires to skate.

But even without the issues around her accident and safety gear, Sky is clearly a polished performer who's pieces to camera are extremely scripted and inauthentic. I question the whole story about how Team Japan was too intense and Team GB was more fun, so that's what made her parents feel ok about her skating with them. Because she clearly isn't a child who's skating ambitions and achievements are solely driven by her own sense of fun. She's someone who does a lot of carefully planned promotional work and it's not her planning that.

I fully believe she absolutely loves skateboarding. I fully believe she wants to be in competition, even as high as Olympic level. I fully believe she loves her training, wants to do it, and was fully determined to get back on her board after her accident. I don't think anyone has to push her to skate as she does. (Obviously I have no real clue but from what I see, it's what I believe.) But if she was my child, that would be my limit. She would do no unnecessary promotional work. No heavily scripted youtube/insta vids. No kids Dancing With the Stars shows. She could indulge in her sport to her highest level if she really wanted, as as much as possible every other moment of her life would be childhood. Because for one, I'd avoid making her sports-persona too much of her identity, so that she could always feel free to reassess her ambitions and walk away if she felt she really wanted to.

I don't know, it just makes me very, very uncomfortable. I discovered as an adult that I was very good at a sport I always loved watching. It was a weird feeling as I love being so good at something I always fantasised about but I know now that if I'd been training since I was a child I could have risen to a reasonably high level. I'm not saying I'd have been an Olympic qualifier/medalist or anything but I could probably have built a career around it, first as an athlete and then as a coach. It felt bittersweet for the first year or so knowing that in other circumstances my lifelong fantasy could have been a reality. But, once I really thought about it, I'm just so glad I had a healthy childhood. There is so much abuse of children with high sporting potential, and it seems to be especially true of girls. I don't believe Sky is being abused in those ways. But I can't say that I believe she isn't being exploited. I don't believe she's getting to make as much of her childhood as she can.

And while I don't know a huge amount about skateboarding, I have read speculation that there are certain moves she does, like landing a 1080 jump, the only female boarder to do so, that are actually easier for children. This isn't just true of Sky, there have been a number of major jumps achieved by children that it's possible may not be achievable by adults. And if that's true, pressure will start to mount on those children to stay physically as small and childlike as possible for as long as possible. Just like I believe was a problem in women's gymnastics?

CatrinVennastin · 03/07/2021 13:07

@trancepants Thank you. I had no idea that Sky did all the other promotional stuff.

The safety aspects are interesting too.

I am not convinced that under 16’s so be taking part in high level sporting events like the olympics.

My cousin was a professional basketball player in the US and his training regimes from a young age were brutal. I would say it did impact his childhood.

Imasoulman · 03/07/2021 13:09

@MrGHardy

How is this legal? In gymnastics they have a minimum age, though I guess that also has to do with flexibility and exploitation. But still, it seems odd a child can perform professionally. In Germany there was quite a debate when the Bundesliga recently started to allow 16 year olds to play.

Neither of them are professional!
They are children enjoying a sport.

Kanaloa · 03/07/2021 13:12

Fantastic for her, she seems a really driven and confident young lady. Lovely as well to see her excelling in a sport that’s often so male dominated.

I’m sure girls have performed professionally in gymnastics previously around this age so I don’t think she’s unusually young for competitive sports? I do agree if it was my child I would not allow the social media presence but that seems to be the way of the world now unfortunately.

TinselAngel · 03/07/2021 13:21

That's all really interesting trancepants and clarifies some of the things I instinctively felt uncomfortable about. I'd thought that there were probably moves that it's easier for somebody small and light to do and so that like gymnastics there's the risk of it starting a trend for younger competitors.

trancepants · 03/07/2021 13:28

Yup, here she is on Junior Dancing With the Stars just after her 10th birthday. (She actually says she's 9 at the start, then remembers she's 10.) She's a 10 year old professional athlete at this point. That should have been more than enough in terms of time not to be a child. She went on to win the show, so I'm assuming, that was months and months of dance training, filming and promotional work that she was doing instead of just enjoying some down time.

And that's not to mention the hip rolls and wiggles in the short-shorts, which no 10 year old of mine would be allowed to be coached to do. If you can't do a non-sexually suggestive salsa, then don't do a salsa. Do a tap dance or something instead.

Angelica789 · 03/07/2021 13:39

The minimum age for adult gymnastics was raised. Young girls have a flexibility advantage but for whatever reason it was deemed inappropriate for them to compete at the highest level.

TinselAngel · 03/07/2021 13:43

I don't really understand how you can be a professional anything aged 10.

Reallyreallyborednow · 03/07/2021 13:49

I'm not sure how I feel about this. It was very bad when the top female gymnasts were her age

This. The minimum age for gymnastics was raised to 16 due to safeguarding concerns. There are many currently saying it should be 18.

As we have seen with gymnastics- in the 80’s is was normal to have 12 and 13 year old olympians- that the regimes to create these champions so young are extremely damaging physically and mentally.

Personally I think the minimum age for the olympics should be 16 for every sport.

Reallyreallyborednow · 03/07/2021 13:53

I’m sure girls have performed professionally in gymnastics previously around this age so I don’t think she’s unusually young for competitive sports?

Gymnastics has learned its lessons and has raised the minimum age to 16 to safeguard it’s athletes.

Other sports should also learn from this.

Watch “athlete a” about how little autonomy these kids have. It left young teenagers open to sexual and emotional abuse.