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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Gardeners required

59 replies

Wrongsideofhistorymyarse · 12/06/2021 11:10

Katie Alcock's case against Girlguiding is being heard soon and the garden is in dire need of gardening.

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Imnobody4 · 12/06/2021 11:13

Thanks for the reminding - off to find spade.

Bordois · 12/06/2021 11:14

I have a trowel but not sure where I should be digging?

AtLeastPretendToCare · 12/06/2021 11:19

Have done a little gardening

MishyJDI · 12/06/2021 11:21

No way I would be digging to support prejudice against kids, except to bury said prejudice. Just let the kids be themselves. Instead I will go and dig the gardens of Girl Guides so they have enough crops to fight such prejudice.

CorvusPurpureus · 12/06/2021 11:22

Thanks for the reminder. I'll nip off & find me mattock!

WineAcademy · 12/06/2021 11:23

Interesting how some people manage to misconstrue safety and dignity for girls and women as "prejudice". Says a lot about such people, imo.

MingeofDeath · 12/06/2021 11:29

Good to see Mishy being as entertaining as ever.

EmbarrassingAdmissions · 12/06/2021 11:32

I was waiting to see if a generous donor would offer to match donations for Sex Matters in the event of a positive Forstater ruling - and because it happened, I have pledged there because having the money doubled is irresistible.

I'm fairly tapped out but I'll see what I can cancel to do something for this.

InspiralCoalescenceRingdown · 12/06/2021 11:53

Miraculous! Mishy majestically mostly mangles money metaphors.

Helleofabore · 12/06/2021 12:06

Strange how 'safeguarding' can become so twisted. It must indeed be frustrating that 'safeguarding' means that no one can be given any priority so that their identification take precedence over the material reality of their sex.

It is also very interesting to think about the wider ramifications here and exactly who benefits from diluting safeguarding particularly around children.

And the history of the Scouts movement is something to be considered. Guides has thankfully seemed relatively free of it. Perhaps due to once rigorous safeguarding .... that is now being eroded under the guidance of some advisors who have personal histories that might not bear scrutiny very well.

As a parent of a Guide, I welcome the strongest safeguarding measures and complete transparency of those attending camps. Why should anyone wanting the same be shamed for this?

DisappearingGirl · 12/06/2021 12:11

I see Katie has two gardening patches as her solicitor moved firms, and the current one has a title starting "My court case"

justanotherneighinparadise · 12/06/2021 12:19

Forgetting any accusations of prejudice, it just seems really interesting to me that many teenage girls are in relationships with trans girls and the risk of pregnancy must be a concern. Those relationships must be going on in girl guides as well as elsewhere and would the parents be happy those kids were unchaperoned overnight?

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 12/06/2021 12:26

Ah, thank you.

I have a shovelful of rage waiting, and was looking for somewhere to put my £50.

Does it ever occur to the 'no debate' squad that silencing women just makes them angry, and that anger can result in action?

334bu · 12/06/2021 12:27

🌱🌽

Wrongsideofhistorymyarse · 12/06/2021 12:30

@GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman

Ah, thank you.

I have a shovelful of rage waiting, and was looking for somewhere to put my £50.

Does it ever occur to the 'no debate' squad that silencing women just makes them angry, and that anger can result in action?

Of course not. And they don't expect us to find action against them.
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InspiralCoalescenceRingdown · 12/06/2021 13:24

@justanotherneighinparadise

Forgetting any accusations of prejudice, it just seems really interesting to me that many teenage girls are in relationships with trans girls and the risk of pregnancy must be a concern. Those relationships must be going on in girl guides as well as elsewhere and would the parents be happy those kids were unchaperoned overnight?
Quite. This would presumably be one of the primary safeguarding concerns for teens?
TedImgoingmad · 12/06/2021 13:39

@MishyJDI

No way I would be digging to support prejudice against kids, except to bury said prejudice. Just let the kids be themselves. Instead I will go and dig the gardens of Girl Guides so they have enough crops to fight such prejudice.
I'm going to guess that you know nothing about Girlguiding. Nothing.

As a Guide Leader, I have proudly planted some flowers for Katie. As a sister to all Guides, I stand with Katie, and thank her for standing up for girls, women and the truth.

TedImgoingmad · 12/06/2021 13:47

@justanotherneighinparadise

Forgetting any accusations of prejudice, it just seems really interesting to me that many teenage girls are in relationships with trans girls and the risk of pregnancy must be a concern. Those relationships must be going on in girl guides as well as elsewhere and would the parents be happy those kids were unchaperoned overnight?
The Chief Exec who oversaw Stonewall law invading Girlguiding policy was Julie Bentley. She had been the head of the Family Planning Association. What on earth she of all people was thinking might happen, when horny teens of both biological sexes share a tent, remains a complete mystery.

We have a new Chief Exec now. GGUK have in the last week doubled down on their inclusion policy. They have obviously not taken any notice of the pushback against Stonewall. I have to wonder if it will take a girl suffering some serious damage for them to actually listen and learn.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 12/06/2021 14:04

@MishyJDI

No way I would be digging to support prejudice against kids, except to bury said prejudice. Just let the kids be themselves. Instead I will go and dig the gardens of Girl Guides so they have enough crops to fight such prejudice.
Useful article by ExcelPope (a school governor) identifying how Safeguarding should work: (extract) "I spend a lot of time designing policies and procedures, and what I tell people is this:- Imagine a worst-case scenario occurs. There is an official investigation, where you’re asked “What did you do to prevent this happening?”. Now imagine what answer you’d like to be able to give to that question in that scenario – that’s the starting point for writing your policies.

In that vein, here’s a scenario.

You are the head-teacher of a secondary school, with pupils aged 11-18. A police officer arrives at the school and asks to speak to you. They have found a video on a porn site which shows the changing-rooms at your school, including a number of girls, who appear to be aged 13-15, in various states of undress. It has clearly been filmed with a concealed camera-phone.

The video has been taken down, but not before it had tens of thousands of views. The account that posted it has been traced to a student at the school who identifies themselves as trans and was, in accordance with the guidance, allowed to use the female changing rooms.

The police need a female member of staff to view the video with them, to identify the 20 or 30 teenage girls who appear in it, so that they and their parents can be informed that they have been victims of voyeurism.

What did you do to prevent this happening?" (continues)

There are around 2.2 million males aged 13-18 in the UK, no matter how much experience you have with children, with trans people, with trans-children, you cannot absolutely assert that none of them will abuse, or attempt to abuse, the guidance given in a manner that infringes of the rights of other students.

This isn’t about demonising all trans people, or suggesting that any given one of them would act in such a manner. This is about the risk presented by the guidance itself, whether that risk can be mitigated in a manner which is proportional to the potential seriousness of the outcome and whether the risk is, in part or in whole, outweighed by the risks of not implementing the guidance." (continues)

excelpope.wordpress.com/2019/02/28/the-unaskable-question/

BingBongSong · 12/06/2021 15:01

Just dug. I went to the wrong crowd funder to start with though. It worked when I included "My Court Case" in my search bar.

KleineDracheKokosnuss · 12/06/2021 15:23

The fact that GG have doubled down and continue to avoid engaging with the very obvious safeguarding problems is the reason I just quit as a leader.

Wrongsideofhistorymyarse · 12/06/2021 15:27

Sorry to hear that Kleine. When I was an assistant leader years ago safeguarding was taken very seriously.

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morningtoncrescent62 · 12/06/2021 15:28

Bookmarked for the end of the month. I did some digging in the ForWomen Scot plot last week and that's this month's seeds used up.

Blibbyblobby · 12/06/2021 15:36

@justanotherneighinparadise

Forgetting any accusations of prejudice, it just seems really interesting to me that many teenage girls are in relationships with trans girls and the risk of pregnancy must be a concern. Those relationships must be going on in girl guides as well as elsewhere and would the parents be happy those kids were unchaperoned overnight?
Yes, this is one of the huge issues with Trans Orthodoxy. It takes structures set up for one group of people (the female-bodied) and insists they have to now apply exactly as is to a different group of people (the woman-identifying) without any changes or assessment of whether what was right for the first group is also right for the second.

Girl guides that can get other girl guides pregnant is a very clear illustration of why this belief that society can replace single sex with single gender but everything else stays the same is just plain wrong.

Alicethruthelookingglass · 12/06/2021 18:21

Given that the current Guiding rules were advised on by none other than Aimee Chanellor, I agree they should be examined.

And those who support Aimee and the pedo agenda should examine their souls.