Ofcom finds 50% of UK men (rising to 3/4s for young men) visited pornhub in Sep 2020

[duffed]

Well this is depressing... I'm not sure I've seen independent stats on porn use in the UK before.

"Half the adult population of the UK watched online pornography during the pandemic, according to a projection by Ofcom which lays bare the activities of the 26 million individuals who view adult material.

By far the most popular pornography site was PornHub, which was visited by 50% of all males and 16% of all females in the UK in September 2020 – giving the site a far larger audience than mainstream television channels such as Sky One, ITV4 and BBC News.

The figures rise substantially among younger age groups, with a third of young women and three-quarters of young men visiting PornHub in the four weeks covered by the research."

www.theguardian.com/media/2021/jun/09/half-british-adults-watched-porn-pandemic-ofcom

"@MargaritaPie it’s the same with child abuse online - very difficult to police but there are penalties and it is illegal."

Completely different. One key difference is that society wants people who look at underage porn to be convicted and sent to prison. However those who want people who look at consensual-adult-porn to be convicted and sentenced are in a very small minority. As seen from the linked article about above the situation in Iceland- noone really cares if (consensual adult) porn is made illegal. The police have better things to do.

"What I think IS a good and doable idea is for the main search engines to not return porn unless it's obvious from search terms that's what is being looked for."

For what it's worth, I do know is Google's search prediction will stop suggesting results as soon as it realises something sexual is being searched for.

Even if the big search engines did stop returning porn results, people who want to search for porn(does anyone still use a search engine for porn anyway? don't people just search direct from something like pornhub?) will just use another search engine. Or use a darkweb search engine if they had to. There's always a way.

Even if the big search engines did stop returning porn results, people who want to search for porn(does anyone still use a search engine for porn anyway? don't people just search direct from something like pornhub?) will just use another search engine. Or use a darkweb search engine if they had to. There's always a way.

This is true of child abuse images, also.

By this logic we should decriminalise all crimes, as criminalisation doesn't completely eliminate crime.

"By this logic we should decriminalise all crimes, as criminalisation doesn't completely eliminate crime."

I think you might have misunderstood my logic.

@MargaritaPie

"By this logic we should decriminalise all crimes, as criminalisation doesn't completely eliminate crime."

I think you might have misunderstood my logic.

Then do enlighten me.

I think that's an extrapolation as well and I have no idea how they know sex age etc.

I have a VPN for work and it's a different network ID each time I have to refresh it (daily).

Fair to say that plenty will be using a VPN etc.

Also. PornHub own stats?

For me yes loads of adults and children will have searched it out of curiosity etc. It's in the news all the time, they learn it at school, hear about it etc.

It's not great that this content is a click away that's another issue.

To me there's a huge difference between looking out of curiosity once or twice. Looking at it regularly. And the types of content.

We know... Well I know what is popular. How grim it is. How racist, misogynist. How most of it caters to male sexual domination of women. Women being abused, essentially, whatever the pretence is about what stuff like 'ruined' means...

How male gay porn, the home page stuff. Is totally different.

The fact that sites are lauded for saying we're going to stop hosting content depicting rape (and plenty of it was rape).

I was talking to DH last night and this is I suppose like whackamole. Women gain in one area. Get pushed back in another. Over and over.

Loads and loads of men are resentful of women's relatively recent economic freedom and choice around relationships. And it festers out in this mass enjoyment of women being sexually dominated by men.

That and the internet has allowed things to spiral.

Male sexual domination of women is just so constant. It's interesting how different types and situations and parts of the world get different reactions.

Usually things over >>> there are bad and terrible and they need to sort it out. While things over here get a bit of hand wringing in the press, a bit of that's awful, but in general that's it. There's no actual change or action.

So I suppose is the type of porn ubiquitous know a cause or a symptom? A bit of both probably.

@MargaritaPie

"What I think IS a good and doable idea is for the main search engines to not return porn unless it's obvious from search terms that's what is being looked for."

For what it's worth, I do know is Google's search prediction will stop suggesting results as soon as it realises something sexual is being searched for.

Even if the big search engines did stop returning porn results, people who want to search for porn(does anyone still use a search engine for porn anyway? don't people just search direct from something like pornhub?) will just use another search engine. Or use a darkweb search engine if they had to. There's always a way.

No it doesn't!!!

And I'm saying don't return porn if people type hanster (what I typed looking for hamster pics) etc.

Porn is very commonly searched and so if the algorithm isn't sure and it sounds a bit like a porn site name it will provide that on the basis that's what most people want.

I'm saying if the main search engines agreed only to return porn if the search terms made it a obvious that was what was wanted then it would prevent a lot of people including little kids being presented with porn links when they weren't looking for that at all.

That's easy to do and will help a bit and although I'm sure some would say it's out of line, it's no trouble to correct a spelling.

"Then do enlighten me."

I'm definitely not saying we shouldn't have laws. I'm saying there's no use in having laws almost noone wants or cares about (such as making consensual adult porn illegal).

Some laws can arguably be harmful. eg the war on drugs, it's been going on for over half a century and look at the heroin overdose rates in the UK(they are amongst the worst in Europe). Many countries in Europe have safe injecting rooms, addicts can use without fear of arrest, or in the case of Portugal decriminalised all drugs(Portugal has seen success with this).

Laws are needed, but passing a law to criminalise every x or y someone dislikes isn't the answer, and in some cases can make matters worse.

The stats are FROM PORNHUB.

Always look at the source.

I'm willing to guess their careful counting showed that everyone who accessed the site was over 18

They have a very strong motivation to present using porn as

A. Common and normal

And

B. Women love it too

I wouldn't trust a word they say.

@InspiralCoalescenceRingdown

Even if the big search engines did stop returning porn results, people who want to search for porn(does anyone still use a search engine for porn anyway? don't people just search direct from something like pornhub?) will just use another search engine. Or use a darkweb search engine if they had to. There's always a way.

This is true of child abuse images, also.

By this logic we should decriminalise all crimes, as criminalisation doesn't completely eliminate crime.

1. Seeking images of child sexual abuse (as opposed to looking at barley legal on mainstream sites and pretending everyone is adult and having fun) will not bring results on any mainstream search engines except for news etc. This imagery is shared in private groups, servers not accessible to standard search engines etc

1. I have read more than once by those speaking for the police that viewing images of child sexual abuse is so common that there's no point pursuing it as they wouldn't be able to do anything else. (Read. Not important. 'good' men's lives 'ruined'. No real appetite to go after these men in society etc)

1. Arguably (and I would argue) the vast majority of sex offences against women and girls are effectively decriminalised in this country anyway

@PearPickingPorky

God, I'm shocked. That is very high. So 50% of men were watching the violent sexual abuse of women? Or, in many cases, children?

That's not what it means at all, Christ. Drama Queen much?

Also it's probably higher as that's only the stat for ONE of many, many porn websites.

I find the the argument that

If you can't ban porn (which you can't without total state control of the internet plus a range of other strict and intrusive measures)

Then you might as well make everything legal

Ridiculous.

There are two fights.

The fight to change society how women and girls are viewed etc and make sex offences actually seen as bad

And

Think of ways, any ways to reduce the availability of this material to young people

1. Involves addressing things which society is not interested in addressing and

1. Annoys men so

Fuck knows what to do.

And again for those who missed it.

I posted a link to the actual doc.

The stats are compiled from various sources including PornHub...

Pinch of salt.

It isn't just about "can we ban porn". It's also about "do most people want porn to be banned", and I'm sure a comfortable majority of adults would not want that.

Porn is legal apart from certain specified categories.

What bothers me is the nature of it and how it reflects society.

I've seen so many images and clips over the years that are called 'porn' because there are scantily clad or naked women. But are actually about degradation, humiliation etc. These sort of things are shared between men and laughed at, usually in a that's disgusting way.

That's about male bonding over dehumanising, othering, abusing women. Not about wanking.

It's like crime. A man walks up to a man on the street and holds a knife to his throat. Crime. A man does this to a woman he's only just met in his home after a snog. Weellll. It's just a sex game!

It's awful.

People watch horror films and don’t go around murdering people slaying through the night

OK... what about people who watch snuff films on the internet, actual footage of people actually being killed? That would be a more accurate analogy, since porn isn't acted, it's simply filmed prostitution. Those women really are being abused (and by the way you have no way to know if they even nominally consented to it).

I'm sure most of the people accessing genuine murder footage on the murkiest corners of the internet aren't murderers themselves either, but they are fucking sick and I certainly wouldn't trust them.

Luckily our society makes it difficult to access footage of real murders and basically impossible to stumble upon it by mistake (although like footage of child sex abuse, it's certainly out there and people who are interested in finding it can do so). If only we could do the same for footage of real rapes.

Smoking is legal. But it is recognised as being bad for the individual (lung cancer) and bad for society (cost to NHS). Therefore the govt don't actively criminalise smoking but take steps to disincentivise: taxation, advertising ban.

Like smoking, porn is legal. Like smoking, porn is bad for the individual (erectile dysfunction, impact on meaningful romantic relationships) and bad for society (objectification of women, rape culture).

Even if they don't ban it, the govt could still disincentivise it. Instead, its presented as normal/bit of fun/a way to spice up your sex life

@Conniethesensible

How about we let consenting adults choose to do what they want in their spare time. Are you trying to get porn banned OP?

Yup. Because for the most part, it's non consensual, non age verified, rape depiction.

Anyone watching this stuff is kidding themselves it's empowering women.

@MargaritaPie

"Then do enlighten me."

I'm definitely not saying we shouldn't have laws. I'm saying there's no use in having laws almost noone wants or cares about (such as making consensual adult porn illegal).

Some laws can arguably be harmful. eg the war on drugs, it's been going on for over half a century and look at the heroin overdose rates in the UK(they are amongst the worst in Europe). Many countries in Europe have safe injecting rooms, addicts can use without fear of arrest, or in the case of Portugal decriminalised all drugs(Portugal has seen success with this).

Laws are needed, but passing a law to criminalise every x or y someone dislikes isn't the answer, and in some cases can make matters worse.

Yes, and there's a good evidence base to show the medicalisation over criminalisation has worked well in Portugal.

Your evidence base on pornography is...?

@NiceGerbil you're absolutely correct. I was more alluding to the dark web and "there's always a way".

Sadly, you're especially right about point 3.

'Luckily our society makes it difficult to access footage of real murders'

That's not true at all though.

When you read about terrorists there's often stuff saying they watched beheading videos etc.

Just trying to think so may be random.

Saddam Hussein's hanging was televised.

There are pics of explosions and then dead people on the news all the time.

UK news is quite careful but I think other countries are more graphic and that's all mainstream.

I think finding murder/ violent killing on the net is probably really easy.

I would like to see paying for sex banned.

I would like to see a massive change in the police etc around sex crime.

I would like to see societal change to make using porn as frowned upon as smoking.

Banning it?
Where's the line? There will never be agreement.
The internet? Can't be done without the type of government control that doesn't happen outside north Korea. And even there tor etc is used to get and share info.

You can't police the internet. It just doesn't work that way.

You can press to make society including men not think watching women being abused is sexy.

But the evidence is that given the opportunity. Men in general like to do that. So. That's a bit of a problem.

You have to have widely understood set of social beliefs about sex that say that kind of sex is inherently problematic. And it needs to be based in something more than it tends to hurt people or be exploitative. It has to be underpinned by an explanation of why sex is like that.

That is unlikely to touch on both prostitution and porn and leave everything else alone, which would immediately create objections. Lots of sex that people choose to have is dangerous, exploitative of others or oneself, self-destructive, unhealthy. We consider those things are their choice.

So long as people think that way, they are unlikely to see a significant necessity to prevent people making similar choices around the marketplace. They might be convinced that it can't be regulated adequately so would be better banned, but that's a little different than saying that the sexual activity and choices involved are inherently exploitative (as opposed to pragmatically exploitative.)

'You have to have widely understood set of social beliefs about sex that say that kind of sex is inherently problematic'

???

Who said that??

We're talking about porn, not having sex