Imposter syndrome - a female only thing?

[KitchenDancefloor]

Hi, I'm posting this in feminism chat but I'm not sure if it belongs here, but just wanted to get it off my chest.

I really struggle with imposter syndrome, feeling like I'm winging it through life and any moment someone is going to catch me out. I'll be fired from the job I am qualified for and have years of experience in. My kids will work out that parenting is something I do but don't fully understand and will never take me seriously again, etc.

After a day of minor things going wrong and feeling self-critical, I asked my husband if he ever gets imposter syndrome. Not only had he not heard of it, but he couldn't grasp the concept when I explained it to him as it was so alien to him. "But why would someone catch you out? You're not doing anything wrong. Who would be looking for your mistakes anyway?" He was very literal and just didn't get it.

So my question is, do men get imposter syndrome? I've worked with some men who seem to have the opposite issue of misplaced self confidence in their mediocre abilities (and lots of sensible, decent types too).

DH definitely has it. He knows, objectively, he's good at his job but still gets THE FEAR every time his boss asks "for a word".

Speaking to a male friend recently with a very high powered job, who I thought would be very confident, I found out he has possibly the worse case of it of anyone I know! Wakes up on cold sweats in the night thinking "this is the day I'll get found out as a blagger and get sacked".

I think it's far more common than we know.

Certainly men get it. My extremely capable DH does.

As an aside, I have enormous doubts about my capabilities, despite my professional qualifications. I doubt the qualifications actually qualified me for anything in terms of competence, and I wonder how you can tell if you're suffering from impostor syndrome or are just an actual impostor?

Yes, men get it, as PP mentioned.

I'm also in one of these fields where drive and achievement are the norm (as are men ...), and I definitely know that a lot of very smart, very capable men, in particular, have this.

Men often show it differently than women, though. One of my "serial offenders", for example, blatantly over-compensates. It doesn't take rocket scientist to figure out why (and we're close enough for him to have confirmed it to me once after a couple of drinks). But on the job he's all "aren't I the rock star?!" and "my underling X did really well - look at how well I HAVE prepped him for it!", etc.

Whereas the women, myself included, often tend to either go silent or - my personal choice - be quite radically transparent about it if the situation allows it.

"Look, I feel ridiculously underqualified and as though I'm winging it here 80% of my time - but my rational brain tells me this is my imposter syndrome and managing it is, literally, part of the job" is something I share with people I coach or mentor frequently when they bring up similar issues of their own.

Ultimately, in my opinion, this is the emotionally mature way of handling it. Also, ironically, the less risky strategy in terms of not "getting caught" for weaknesses. I admit that I have plenty - nobody feels the need to go looking. Whereas the willy waving tends to have the opposite effect as soon as someone buys it and feels threatened.

I wonder how you can tell if you're suffering from impostor syndrome or are just an actual impostor?

Exactly!!

Should add, I've adopted the "own it and discuss it with juniors and subordinates you see struggle" from a mentor of my own. A man, actually.

I still credit him with making my entire career possible for saying that one sentence "hey, look, I'm utterly terrified that I'm not good enough and that they'll all find out, too!".

I will love and look up to that man forever for it. He didn't make the feeling go away - but hearing it from someone who was, basically, "business god, the sales lord and revenue redeemer" in my worldview at the time allowed me some perspective for the first time in my life!

This thread is particularly timely for me as today is actually my first day in a new role, new sector, working from home with v little guidance AND its probably the most senior role of my career. I've been fighting the urge all day to call up the boss, tell him he's made a terrible mistake and that I am very sorry to have wasted his time, and that I quit.

So thanks to those on here who have shared!

(Back to work now... )

Not sure how relevant this is, but imposter syndrome reminds me of something else, which is in some ways the same and in some ways the opposite.

My theory is that a child does not become an adult at 16 or 18 or 21. A child becomes an adult when they realize that 90% of adults are blagging it 90% of the time.

@SirSamuelVimes

This thread is particularly timely for me as today is actually my first day in a new role, new sector, working from home with v little guidance AND its probably the most senior role of my career. I've been fighting the urge all day to call up the boss, tell him he's made a terrible mistake and that I am very sorry to have wasted his time, and that I quit.

So thanks to those on here who have shared!

(Back to work now... )

First day, new role, new sector, v. little guidance... looks to me like it is your boss who's is the one that is failing here, not you. What are they pro-actively doing to get you up to speed? Good luck

In my own anecdotal experience I’d say a higher percentage of women than men suffer from it.

Michelle Obama has spoken very eloquently about the topic:

I would suggest it's more a class than a sex thing.

My OH comes from a very working class background and, even though he is a very successful senior professional, struggles with IS a lot.

On the other hand, I - also at senior director level - come from a more middle class background and am more comfortable with the concept of 'winging it', because my face and accent fits...

@JediGnot

Not sure how relevant this is, but imposter syndrome reminds me of something else, which is in some ways the same and in some ways the opposite.

My theory is that a child does not become an adult at 16 or 18 or 21. A child becomes an adult when they realize that 90% of adults are blagging it 90% of the time.

Oh hell yes!

First day, new role, new sector, v. little guidance... looks to me like it is your boss who's is the one that is failing here, not you. What are they pro-actively doing to get you up to speed?

Ha, not much! But if they're shit, I can be shit too

Yes, men get it. I think it's more a personality thing than anything else, it crops up in any scenarios. Though possibly more often for people in more senior types of roles.

It's common in men too, they just don't speak about it. We still have a system where our DH's don't talk to us about feelings etc. Us woman often better rely on our support networks.

@GrimDamnFanjo

It's a personal view but I don't think men doubt themselves in the same way. When I worked in recruitment i noticed that men would take a punt on applying for a job if they didn't tick all the boxes. Women tended to really agonise whether they should or not. Wonder if there's any research on this?

I won't apply for a job if I don't tick all the boxes, but that's because when I was a school governor I did recruitment training and we were told that if something was "essential" the person had to have it, or you couldn't interview them. Different if listed under desirable.

So if I see a job advertisement and I don't meet all the criteria I don't apply. At least in the public sector, the private sector can do what it likes within the boundaries of discrimination law.

But nothing to do with being a woman. However, research indicates that men just apply. How many times they get the job though, I don't know.

My DH has it with respect to his job.

Neither of us have it with respect to being parents - we know we are not perfect human beings and don't expect to be perfect. We are however confident that we've been good enough. Most parents who love their children are good enough and nobody is perfect.

I'd be interested to know if women who went to single-sex schools are less likely to experience imposter syndrome

I don't know. On the one hand I'd say not because you believe you can do anything. On the other hand girls are really bitchy and you can have your confidence knocked out of you at a very early age.

But I would say that my lack of confidence at work has come from the sector I've worked in and the micro-managers I've encountered.