University staff given list of banned 'microinsults' they cannot say to trans people

[ChristinaXYZ]

From the Telegraph. the last para make you want to weep -

A Newcastle University spokesman said: "We want our campus to be a welcoming and safe place for everyone who studies, works or visits here, regardless of gender, race, class, age or disability."

But it would seem they are not bothered about making people feel welcome regardless of sex, as they don't even mention it.

@YetAnotherSpartacus

Meanwhile, the glass ceiling for women academics lives on unchallenged, women do the bulk of the first year teaching whilst watching younger men shoot ahead with promotions, and there are multiple, daily, aggressions and microaggressions leveled at and experienced by women and no one gives a proverbial.

Hear hear.

@Chrysanthemum5 I was about to respond with the same thing. The head of school appears to have apologised to students before doing an investigation. And I seem to recall seeing other statements from Ed Uni about its commitment to academic freedom while throwing any academic who doesn't toe the approved line under the bus. If I were a young academic watching what's happened to Neil Thin I can't imagine I'd pursue anything other than the woke student-approved line in teaching and research.

Yes, I’ve read and watched quite a lot about Bret W and the Evergreen State fiasco, badger, and I agree that’s end point we should all be concerned about. But I’m keen to understand what is envisaged to happen to transgressors now, too. I’m still not clear from Catherina’s answer above, as that just seems to be another part of the policy.

Imagine I’m a lecturer at Edinburgh. A student complains of my micro aggressions.

What then? Am I sent on training, do I have to promise not to do it again, does it appear in my performance evaluation....what?

Because what I fear is that it forms a blacklist. Like Joe McCarthy’s. That did not turn out well. And those on the blacklist will be subject to the sort of pressure that biscuits talks about above.

I don’t think that improves relationships and communities.

Trying to find source for the document, and happened to find this article:

www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/7009932/edinburgh-university-uk-campus-sex-attack/

'EDINBURGH University has been ranked as the UK’s third top campus for sex attack allegations on a new site.'

Is there any action being taken on this issue? Or is it just policing language that EU are interested in?

@HamsterV2 I found your perspective interesting and I had not thought about it this way. I wouldn't want a document written about microaggressions about women as it could suggest women are victims, and can see that these documents do not help transpeople.

Fairer dialogue that does not damage any other groups would be a good way forward rather than controlling messages or supression.

I see rainbow lanyards the same way as I see pronouns in email signatures - as a useful warning.

Speaking of academics, do we know yet how many micro-agressions can dance on the head of a needle?

I studied Classics. Athens, the cradle of democracy, was a city where women had no rights and everyone with enough money owned slaves. Young boys were routinely expected to have romantic and often sexual relationships with older boys and men. Ancient Rome was marginally less dreadful for women, IIRC, but still very bad in modern terms (women literally property of the father until married, when they became property of the husband), and also a slave society, and of course they were the supreme colonisers, appropriating other people's cultures left, right and centre as they gradually took over most of the known world. I can only assume my subject is going to be obliterated. Goodbye Homer, Hesiod, Aeschylus, Sophocles, Euripides, Aristophanes, Plato, Aristotle, Thucydides, Herodotus, Pindar, Sappho and many, many others. Valete, Virgil, Catullus, Horace, Ovid, Cicero, Livy, Caesar, Plautus, Terence, Juvenal, Martial, Lucretius, Pliny etc. Goodbye in the process all the underpinnings of Western thought.

Oddly, when I was a student in the early 80s, it was felt possible to inform us about the nature of these societies and let us draw our own conclusions about them. That would probably cause some university administrators these days to have a panic attack.

Definitely. Like wearing a sandwich board that says "avoid at all costs"

Anything that is LGBTQ+ friendly can fairly safely be defined as not lesbian-friendly.

But avoiding people with rainbow lanyards is "avoidant behaviour" and therefore a "microaggression".

There’s a lot of talk about how only trans people can define transphobia so it should be only fair for lesbians to define lesbophobia. And if I’m triggered by rainbows & pronouns then who are they to contradict me?

(I know it doesn’t work that way but....)

So, if I've been understanding this thread correctly, we can expect this sort of thing to happen.

A student from a strict Muslim background goes to her local university. Her family have insisted she must stay at home during her studies. She is, however, allowed to join a sports team as long as she can wear specially adapted kit. A transwoman joins the team and expects to use the changing room. The Muslim student can't now use it and goes off after practice and matches to find one of the few remaining single-sex spaces on campus to change. The transwoman complains that this is avoidant behaviour. The Muslim student faces a disciplinary hearing.

Not difficult to see that there are many women who are going to struggle with the 'avoidant behaviour' policy. Survivors of sexual abuse are one other obvious group who need single-sex spaces.

I'd like to see universities and university unions called to account for trying to brainwash women into ignoring their instincts and accept that many of their previously single-sex spaces are now effectively mixed sex. Given the appalling record of universities (and schools) on keeping women safe from sexual assault, it doesn't take an Einstein to see this is bound to end in disaster for some unfortunate women (students or staff).

This sign is from the University of Western England, apparently, but I bet there are similar signs in many other places now. Naive in the extreme.

The “protect them from harm” bit is
Are men ever cautioned to protect women from harm?

@HamsterV2 - I thought your post was interesting too and wondered how other trans students might view this kind of policing and maybe not find it helpful or think it shines a spotlight on them which they dont want or makes other students too nervous or awkward to interact with them. If lecturers had constantly treated their female students as frail little flowers when I was studying, I would have found it really annoying.

Not difficult to see that there are many women who are going to struggle with the 'avoidant behaviour' policy. Survivors of sexual abuse are one other obvious group who need single-sex spaces

I'm neither religious nor a survivor of abuse but I would never use a communal changing room because I don't want to be seen naked or see other people naked. It actually would make no difference whether the other people were men, women or mixed.

Wonder if the Maya Forstater appeal's decision will have any bearing on this - if her employers are found to have discriminated against her for holding the opinion, and posting this belief on social media, that you cannot change sex - then would this ruling have any impact upon Edinburgh Uni's language policy?

lesbianandgaynews.com/2021/04/looking-forward-to-the-appeal-in-maya-forstater-v-cgd-by-lgn-legal-commentator-dennis-kavanagh/

I'm not Muslim. I was brought up outside of England as a strict Methodist.

Not my fault. That's the family and the world I was born into.

We moved to England.

Again, not my fault, not my choice.

I am happy to fight compulsory mixed sex changing rooms on the basis of my religious beliefs as I was taught as a child - I don't care what a few trendy ministers are now spouting.

I want my reality, thank you, as supported by the law in England and Wales.

how other trans students might view this kind of policing and maybe not find it helpful or think it shines a spotlight on them which they dont want or makes other students too nervous or awkward to interact with them.

I've certainly heard a number of trans people - transwomen in particular - talk about how this is hurting them. They see people tensing up as they approach, afraid that they're about to get "it's ma'am"ed or something.

They talked about sometimes having to make some sort of self-deprecating joke to get the "trans" out in the air just to defuse the tension and reassure that "it's okay, I'm not one of those".

A new sort of transphobia 2.0 is a real thing, I think. People having the fear that they're about to have to deal with a complete fucking loony that might snap at the slightest provocation, and would have the power to drag them through HR hell.

Although that's not really "transphobia", it's "wokephobia". But I guess there's a prejudice that "trans" = "woke", just like "blue hair" = "woke". So trans people find themselves having acquired a stereotype.

The “protect them from harm” bit is

What is it women are expected to do in order to protect them from harm I wonder? Step in front of them if someone gets aggressive? Get into a verbal disagreement with someone who may harm them?

@Erikrie presumably yes - step in as a barrier. I remember at GC evens which TRAs were picketing that women on the TRA side were asked to physically stand in front of the trans women to protect them

I've certainly heard a number of trans people - transwomen in particular - talk about how this is hurting them. They see people tensing up as they approach, afraid that they're about to get "it's ma'am"ed or something.

What I want to know is what spawned the origination of this document. It said it was co-produced with students, so was that:

a) Trans students. Does Edinburgh Uni have a sufficient statistical anomaly of trans people that they need to make a special policy
b) An overly woke student union
c) Some kind of intervention from an organisation to make the uni look more inclusive.

hey talked about sometimes having to make some sort of self-deprecating joke to get the "trans" out in the air just to defuse the tension and reassure that "it's okay, I'm not one of those".

Yep, been there many times.

Wonderful article - includes hot men for those interested - shines a light on the whole debate.

lesbianandgaynews.com/2021/05/alan-mcmanus-has-got-people-talking-about-hot-gc-men/