Seeking other academics concerned by student sex work

[PhilosophyOnlyRidiculous]

Hello. I'm an academic at a UK university, and am worried about this push to make universities "sex work friendly", and by the development and promotion of sex work "toolkits" (e.g., by University of Leicester, who also collaborate with the university I work at).
Obviously, I'm all for supporting students who are working in the industry, and absolutely do not feel any negative judgment towards the individuals who do.
But surely there are better ways of approaching this than the apparent encouragement in these toolkits? The promoters of these talk about "reassuring" students that what they're doing is legal, and say that universities should support students to balance studies with their sex work.
I get that the guides/toolkits are meant to be realistic about the fact that students WILL do this, and to reduce risk - and that's great. But I really don't think that's all they do.

Just wondered if any other academics are with me on this?

@persistentwoman

It really is a predator's dream isn't it? All these 18 year olds arriving with varying degrees of life experiences and facing this. Who is behind it do you know OP? Are there particular groups pushing this narrative?

Well, there are research groups, funded by the ESRC, involved in the toolkits and related research. The individual researchers may well be very decent people, but who have become caught in a larger agenda.

In terms of the bigger picture - impoverished students casting around for lucrative, risky work to fund their studies - I guess this is Big Politics....

@Babdoc, actually, what I think we need is for parents to COMPLAIN, and to vote with their feet. This is what the unis care about - tuition fees. Parents need to write to the VC of the institutions and make it clear that they will never fund their DC to attend them. THAT will have an impact...

I am a Uni lecturer, and I am feeling quite upset since this news item broke, to think that my livelihood may depend directly on young women being forced into prostitution to pay their fees. Of course I never know where people get their fees money, and there may be many corrupt families who send their kids to us, but this... is too much.

The content of university courses also needs investigating. As a matter of urgency.

On my psychology course, after studying sex work/ers there were female students who said that prior to studying that content they'd never have considered sex work. Post, however, they now would, if they needed the money* because "it's just a job like any other". The material mentioned violence in passing and made no reference to trauma, physical or psychological - other than the impact of stigmatisation in an individual. It also relied on an Amnesty definition of sex work that says if someone is trafficked or subject to violence or forced into it then that's abuse(s), not actually sex work.

I could barely complete the assignments I was so hopping mad. It felt like studying propaganda.

Obviously, New Zealand was hailed as the land of milk and honey for sex workers too.

To be clear, I've no problem with sex workers' voices being heard in course materials. However, more than one side. There are plenty of former sex workers who advocate for the abolition of the industry, so to me, if you're offering the voice of someone who thinks it's a great job, having done it, and who campaigns for it to be decriminalised, then a former sex worker campaigning for its abolition should also be given an equal hearing.

@serendipitea

I am a Uni lecturer, and I am feeling quite upset since this news item broke, to think that my livelihood may depend directly on young women being forced into prostitution to pay their fees. Of course I never know where people get their fees money, and there may be many corrupt families who send their kids to us, but this... is too much.

Yes, I'm very much with you, @serendipitea. And the fact it's the most marginalised and disempowered students "opting" into this "empowering" work to pay for their studies/lifestyles is deeply distressing.

*funny how this reality that women do it out of financial desperation is so easily glossed over, even by those who say they'd only do it if they needed the money!

If it was a job like any other, that qualifier wouldn't be needed.

@GCstudent

The content of university courses also needs investigating. As a matter of urgency.

On my psychology course, after studying sex work/ers there were female students who said that prior to studying that content they'd never have considered sex work. Post, however, they now would, if they needed the money* because "it's just a job like any other". The material mentioned violence in passing and made no reference to trauma, physical or psychological - other than the impact of stigmatisation in an individual. It also relied on an Amnesty definition of sex work that says if someone is trafficked or subject to violence or forced into it then that's abuse(s), not actually sex work.

I could barely complete the assignments I was so hopping mad. It felt like studying propaganda.

Obviously, New Zealand was hailed as the land of milk and honey for sex workers too.

To be clear, I've no problem with sex workers' voices being heard in course materials. However, more than one side. There are plenty of former sex workers who advocate for the abolition of the industry, so to me, if you're offering the voice of someone who thinks it's a great job, having done it, and who campaigns for it to be decriminalised, then a former sex worker campaigning for its abolition should also be given an equal hearing.

Yes, @GCstudent. This.

To be clear, I've no problem with sex workers' voices being heard in course materials. However, more than one side. There are plenty of former sex workers who advocate for the abolition of the industry, so to me, if you're offering the voice of someone who thinks it's a great job, having done it, and who campaigns for it to be decriminalised, then a former sex worker campaigning for its abolition should also be given an equal hearing

I teach the 'other side' and am subject to complaints, criticisms of bias and 'whorephobia'. I'm known as a "SWERF'. Colleagues who teach the authorised 'empowement model' are never criticised.

I read an article earlier about this. I have no connection to academia but as a woman and a parent I find it really depressing.

I think tuition fees have done serious damage in all kinds of ways.

unherd.com/thepost/why-are-universities-so-keen-to-support-prostitution

[quote OvaHere]I read an article earlier about this. I have no connection to academia but as a woman and a parent I find it really depressing.

I think tuition fees have done serious damage in all kinds of ways.

unherd.com/thepost/why-are-universities-so-keen-to-support-prostitution[/quote]
Thanks, @OvaHere - I hadn't seen that article. Great it's written by a current student.

From that article:
Perhaps there is nothing shocking about universities, in their endless quest to produce the best ‘product’ for student consumers, taking on the role of pimps

And this (also from the article):

Teaching staff are (rightly) reprimanded for sexual improprieties with students, thanks to the imbalance of power between them — yet presumably, should a man in a position of power buy sex from a student, those nasty questions of consent disappear into the ether.

This strikes me as the thin end of the wedge. Many students take on crap poorly paid jobs that take all their spare time and energy. I have had students falling asleep in breaks as they are so exhausted from trying to cope with college work & exploitative job. How long before some Universities suggest that sex work is a viable option. Less hours for more cash!

“...and young women seduced by the likes of this woman who is a veteran of porn and web cam work but has a media-friendly front - she’s been interviewed by the BBC about sex work and been on the cover of Guardian Weekend magazine in her ‘sex-educator’ capacity. This is a link to a ‘Vice’ interview - warning though, it’s graphic - it also links to a podcast. Reed Amber is exactly the type of woman who would appeal to any young student who might be thinking about sex work as a harmless income booster. She’s incredibly likeable and I have listened to many of her podcasts and look at her Instagram. I have a teenage daughter and I need to understand the world she’s navigating. I get the impression that she grew up in a very ‘permissive‘ family and she’s very frank and honest about how she sometimes has to ‘push’ herself. Some of what she talks about is genuinely disturbing and I hate how it’s presented as ‘harmless’ because I don’t think she’s engaging with the impact some of her material might have on a young female and male audience.

www.vice.com/en/article/nekjzx/camming-web-cam-cam-girl

Apologies if this is something MN feels I shouldn’t link too - I’m just wanting people to know how this ‘industry‘ could be quite enticing and how young people might not fully understand where it might eventually land them.

OP, I have been pondering your question of what do we do about it.
I think we need to tackle it long before these children reach university. We need to raise our daughters to have the self respect never to sell their bodies to sexual predators, never to collude in objectifying women as lumps of meat, never to believe the “it’s just a job” lies of misogynists and handmaidens.
We need to raise sons who wouldn’t dream of paying to rape a woman who would never have consented unless she was desperate for cash.
And once at uni, girls need access to good financial advice, hardship funds, proper safe job opportunities for supplementing their student loans, etc. My own DDs, one at a Scottish and one at an English uni, said there were loads of legitimate jobs available- nobody needed to resort to anything as vile, dangerous, exploitative and anti feminist as prostitution to pay their bills.
Far from normalising the abuse of young women, the uni should provide counselling and exit strategies for any victims involved in the “industry”, and do their best to ensure no others become ensnared. There are studies showing that prostituted women have higher levels of post traumatic stress than combat veterans- how can any sane person consider that acceptable?

@GCstudent

The content of university courses also needs investigating. As a matter of urgency.

On my psychology course, after studying sex work/ers there were female students who said that prior to studying that content they'd never have considered sex work. Post, however, they now would, if they needed the money* because "it's just a job like any other". The material mentioned violence in passing and made no reference to trauma, physical or psychological - other than the impact of stigmatisation in an individual. It also relied on an Amnesty definition of sex work that says if someone is trafficked or subject to violence or forced into it then that's abuse(s), not actually sex work.

I could barely complete the assignments I was so hopping mad. It felt like studying propaganda.

Obviously, New Zealand was hailed as the land of milk and honey for sex workers too.

To be clear, I've no problem with sex workers' voices being heard in course materials. However, more than one side. There are plenty of former sex workers who advocate for the abolition of the industry, so to me, if you're offering the voice of someone who thinks it's a great job, having done it, and who campaigns for it to be decriminalised, then a former sex worker campaigning for its abolition should also be given an equal hearing.

Very worrying and deeply concerning.

This is grooming going on in plain sight. What's going on here?

On my psychology course, after studying sex work/ers there were female students who said that prior to studying that content they'd never have considered sex work. Post, however, they now would, if they needed the money because "it's just a job like any other".

I would be very interested to know the name of your psychology course if you feel comfortable sharing here of via pm

An acquaintance studied at a humanistic / transpersonal psychotherapy school and was taught by the late John Rowan who advised students that sex with clients could be therapeutic.

Another psychotherapist Brian Thorne was notorious for writing about his exeriences of naked therapy with a vulnerable client called "Sally", his accounts of which can be found easily via open sources

There are disturbing connections between many psychology and psychotherapy organisations and sex worker's unions.

for example

Psychotherapy and Counselling Union
15 December at 05:32 ·
From our colleagues from the English Collective of Prostitutes - International Day to End Violence Against Sex Workers - 17 December 2020, 5pm - Women from Hull and Mayfair on their similar struggles against poverty, violence and criminalisation.
source:
www.facebook.com/PsychotherapyandCounsellingUnion/posts/1569884679879058

Psychotherapy and Counselling Union
9 November ·
Our colleagues from the English Collective of Prostitutes asked to share their activity.
www.facebook.com/PsychotherapyandCounsellingUnion/posts/1538284586372401

There are no shortage of "sexological bodyworkers", "somatic practitioners" and assorted yoni / lingam massagers in the mental health professions, the mental health field has been captured for some time unfortunately.

I do not share the perspective on many posters here about sex work and am not a supporter of the Nordic model. I am however extremely concerned about the capture of mental health services by sex cults and sex worker organisations.

It is not that I am against sex worker rights, I support sex worker rights. I just hate the way that so many campaigning groups that ostensibly support the rights of this or that oppressed or marginalised group have been perverted and captured.

I have been researching how networks that many could call "cults" have been using diversity training and obtaining diversity funding to astroturf grass roots organisations and to capture statutory organisations.

For many years they have been running leadership training courses and "empowerment" courses targeted at various oppressed groups, mostly but not exclusively women as a way of spreading their agenda. We are now reaping a strange harvest as a result.

I just thought that, as the Psychotherapy and Counselling Union has a self declared colleague connection with the English Collective of Prostitutes and thus to the Global Women's Strike, that readers might wish to check a further link, via a graphic artist / illustrator between the Psychotherapy and Counselling Union and Pia Stanchina (of Feminists of London) and Feminists of London

Feminists of London are closely allied with Sisters Uncut and held a virtual vigil including Pia Stanchina, who is a fascinating life coach kind of person, definitely not invovled in a life coaching MLM (because that would never happen, oh no)

Obviously the point I am making in the above post is that the Psychotherapy and Counselling Union has network connections to Sisters Uncut via the English Collective of Prostitutes

Pia Stanchina's website is very interesting

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20201101145849/piastanchina.com/create-a-life-you-love" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/web/20201101145849/piastanchina.com/create-a-life-you-love

and this, well I am lost for words at her generosity

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20210314110116/piastanchina.com/black-lives-matter" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/web/20210314110116/piastanchina.com/black-lives-matter

links for the curious

www.facebook.com/FeministsofLondon/

twitter.com/Feministsof_

www.youtube.com/channel/UCMWny6GIeqx4D5Q99jnuARg

I am not an academic OP but agree that this is concerning. Supporting those who are in sex work to minimise the harm to them is very different to portraying it as normal/desirable.

@hoodathunkit that's pretty shocking stuff. I think that the GMC (for clinical psychotherapists) and BCP ethics guidance is that a therapist engaging in relations with a patient should be struck off / (+/- abuse charges)

I am also extremely uncomfortable with how this is being framed for students. It's one thing not to stigmatise or treat a student any differently in their studies after hearing that they might be doing SW, it's another thing for it to be normalised as a career choice. Especially if people are leaving psychology lectures feeling encouraged to do it

@Voteinvain that vice article was depressing, almost glamourising, when the reality is that often girls are deliberately degraded. I also noted how she stated that men liked that she looked "young" and "innocent".

@persistentwoman

From that article: Perhaps there is nothing shocking about universities, in their endless quest to produce the best ‘product’ for student consumers, taking on the role of pimps

It could actually be considered pretty near to "controlling prostitution for gain" which is the legal term for pimping; considering the financial proceeds would be returned to the university in the form of fees.

@Babdoc

OP, I have been pondering your question of what do we do about it. I think we need to tackle it long before these children reach university. We need to raise our daughters to have the self respect never to sell their bodies to sexual predators, never to collude in objectifying women as lumps of meat, never to believe the “it’s just a job” lies of misogynists and handmaidens. We need to raise sons who wouldn’t dream of paying to rape a woman who would never have consented unless she was desperate for cash. And once at uni, girls need access to good financial advice, hardship funds, proper safe job opportunities for supplementing their student loans, etc. My own DDs, one at a Scottish and one at an English uni, said there were loads of legitimate jobs available- nobody needed to resort to anything as vile, dangerous, exploitative and anti feminist as prostitution to pay their bills. Far from normalising the abuse of young women, the uni should provide counselling and exit strategies for any victims involved in the “industry”, and do their best to ensure no others become ensnared. There are studies showing that prostituted women have higher levels of post traumatic stress than combat veterans- how can any sane person consider that acceptable?

Thank you for the thoughtful response, @Babdoc. I agree about this all starting way before uni. And about working towards proper hardship funds, etc.

Far from normalising the abuse of young women, the uni should provide counselling and exit strategies for any victims involved in the “industry”, and do their best to ensure no others become ensnared.

Yes, I agree with this. Trying to act on it will be very difficult, which is why I wondered whether other academics feel similarly and it'll take collaboration and persistence.

There are studies showing that prostituted women have higher levels of post traumatic stress than combat veterans- how can any sane person consider that acceptable?

And this - yes. There are those who'd argue that there are types of sex work which don't involve the same level of trauma, so these figures are probably disputable in some respects. And of course there are differences between sending worn knickers to someone through the post (which the Toolkit handily highlights as an option ), online camera stuff, and directly selling sex. But while the entire industry tends towards increasing the risk to, and suffering of, women (and many men, albeit often in different ways) in society, and while we're lumping different types of "sex work" together into a nice set of guidelines, we need to think very carefully about all the well-established physical and mental risks (at the time and subsequently) of all these things.

This is a serious issue.

The forum for teenagers thestudentroom was infested with people aggressively arguing that there is no difference between a job shelf-stacking and prostituting yourself to fund uni.

It's also popped up in the Open University's unofficial facebook group as a suggestion to women asking for advice about funding, but we're mature students there, so women aggressively pushed back.