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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Hibo Wardere - Cut

22 replies

TheBuffster · 06/03/2021 12:22

I'm reading the book on fgm and it is harrowing and really an eye opener to how and why fgm happens in the community.

I haven't finished yet, so the answer might be in the book, but I wonder if any of the campaigning around fgm deals with the language and euphemisms for it.

The reason I ask is my experience of fgm training has pretty much been, 'Watch for children being whisked away abroad', but that doesn't really cover the fact that it occurs in the UK, even though it's illegal. I imagine children in lockdown are much more at risk as well.
Anyway, I thought a circulated glossary of terms would be good to accompany training and was wondering if this existed and the training I have had was just crap, or if it's something that needs to be created?

Having considered this a lot recently I have decided that UK schools training is inadequate and relies a lot on the child saying exactly what is going to happen in English, which is obviously a massive assumption when it happens to such young girls.

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PurpleHoodie · 06/03/2021 12:30

I'm not sure what the answers are, but I'd like to say this is part of why "language matters".

Speech.

Compelled speech.

And languages from around the world speech.

Faffertea · 06/03/2021 12:57

The training I’ve had is within the context of healthcare so involved largely medical terminology and focussed on the specific types of FGM and the pathology associated with it. I don’t remember specific discussion about what words women and girls use to describe it themselves but there was focus on non-physical ways in which women and girls may present to healthcare staff.
I agree, being able to understand how women and girls describe FGM in their own words and having the freedom to use those words is hugely important. I wonder if the lack of information on it in training is because there is cultural variation in words used and therefore concern that if they say “women from x country or culture say y when referring to FGM” then women not using those terms may get missed although I would have thought even just a slide in a presentation of some of the terms used would be helpful.
Once again, it’s euphemisms for descriptions of women and girls bodies and the shame that using correct anatomical terms brings, especially about their genitals, that mean their ability to describe their experiences and their oppression is lost.

Cagedbirdsinging · 06/03/2021 13:23

Many years ago and after reading Maya Angelou's heartbreaking novel about a woman who had suffered Female Genital Mutilation , I started donating money to the Adis Ababa Fistula Hospital .
''£100 would provide a surgical repair of the fistula [to stop the incontinence of urine and faeces ,which caused the social shunning of these women] , a pretty new dress and the bus-fare home''.
I once worked with a doctor in a London teaching hospital whose mother , whilst visiting from their homeland , waited til she was at work then took her three daughters -aged between eight and twelve years - and had FGM performed on them . The girls' mother found them when she returned , lying on grass mats in the spare bedroom, crying bitterly in pain and shock.

TheBuffster · 06/03/2021 13:25

Just found this on the nspcc useful to share if you work with children or young people.
www.nspcc.org.uk/what-is-child-abuse/types-of-abuse/female-genital-mutilation-fgm/

Yes agree, free, simple language is really important around all the education.

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Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 06/03/2021 13:30

'@Cagedbirdsinging, that's horrific. What did your colleague do? Her poor little girls. I assume this meant she had had it done as well.

persistentwoman · 06/03/2021 13:37

It's complicated teaching this in schools because if you accept that parents do this to girls because they believe they are making their daughters more marriageable, the potential is to set a child against their family. FGM is usually carried out on younger girls but how do you 'teach' about this to primary children in an age appropriate way? When you work with older teenagers it's often too late or opens a community up to criticism if taught badly in mixed groups of children. That's not to say we mustn't empower girls about this but acknowledging that it's challenging to get this right.
Teachers must be aware of the issues and enabled to safeguard girls and in my experience, the most powerful educators are women like Hibo. That's not to duck our responsibility for protecting girls - more recognising the complexities.
It's unthinkable that campaigners like her & Nimco Ali are being targeted by self centred individuals, uncaring about the rights and safety of girls.

StillFemale · 06/03/2021 13:43

@Cagedbirdsinging

Many years ago and after reading Maya Angelou's heartbreaking novel about a woman who had suffered Female Genital Mutilation , I started donating money to the Adis Ababa Fistula Hospital . ''£100 would provide a surgical repair of the fistula [to stop the incontinence of urine and faeces ,which caused the social shunning of these women] , a pretty new dress and the bus-fare home''. I once worked with a doctor in a London teaching hospital whose mother , whilst visiting from their homeland , waited til she was at work then took her three daughters -aged between eight and twelve years - and had FGM performed on them . The girls' mother found them when she returned , lying on grass mats in the spare bedroom, crying bitterly in pain and shock.
That must have been horrific
Cagedbirdsinging · 06/03/2021 13:55

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g... I don't know what happened next , she resigned though .
The girls' mum had had FGM performed on her , she birthed them and raised them here in the UK specifically so they would not have to endure the lifelong horrors of FGM .; iirc they were born by CS .
(I've started crying again)

SybillTrelawney · 06/03/2021 14:16

@Cagedbirdsinging I'm crying too. I just can't process the thought of that horrific situation your poor friend returned home to, or the suffering of those poor, poor girls. And after everything your friend had done to ensure they were protected, too. A complete and utter violation.

Cagedbirdsinging · 06/03/2021 14:31
Flowers The clitoris , the only organ in human biology and physiology whose sole purpose and function is pleasure ...and they cut and scrape it off to deny these women that pleasure ...
PurpleHoodie · 06/03/2021 14:39

I dont think it is only pleasure.

I'd say it also has a part to play in pain relief, mood regulation, "resilience health" and a lot more.

Studies have been stopped (no funding) or dismissed (mysogyny) so until they are done, we wont be told.

In the meantime, there is anecdotal evidence.

Lowhum · 06/03/2021 15:05

Purple, I’m sure I read somewhere on here that it can help in reliving pain during labour too.

PurpleHoodie · 06/03/2021 15:07

Yes. And period pain.

And injury pain.

StillWeRise · 06/03/2021 15:29

www.nhs.uk/conditions/female-genital-mutilation-fgm/#:~:text=Female%20genital%20mutilation%20(FGM)%20is,megrez%20and%20khitan%2C%20among%20others.
here are a few terms in other languages
in English it might be referred to as being cut or circumcised
teachers, social workers and health care professionals have a mandatory duty to report and should all be receiving training, but if you are interested there are useful resources here
nationalfgmcentre.org.uk/about-us/
if teachers are able to teach sensitively about child abuse, they can teach about fgm

7Days · 06/03/2021 15:40

My God that has given me such a visceral shock.
Those poor little girls

umbel · 06/03/2021 17:23

stillwerise
That NHS video you linked to was heartbreaking. It really hit me just how this practice destroys trust between women - between mothers and daughters and aunties and grandmothers, but also between sisters and friends who can’t talk about it with each other, and between women and the many female professionals who might care for them, but who are feared for what they represent or remind victims of.

MissBarbary · 06/03/2021 17:40

[quote Cagedbirdsinging]@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g... I don't know what happened next , she resigned though .
The girls' mum had had FGM performed on her , she birthed them and raised them here in the UK specifically so they would not have to endure the lifelong horrors of FGM .; iirc they were born by CS .
(I've started crying again)[/quote]
I once worked with a doctor in a London teaching hospital whose mother , whilst visiting from their homeland , waited til she was at work then took her three daughters -aged between eight and twelve years - and had FGM performed on them . The girls' mother found them when she returned , lying on grass mats in the spare bedroom, crying bitterly in pain and shock

It would be difficult but the only correct response would have been to report the grandmother to the police and never let her near her granddaughters again. If the crime had been sexual abuse by the children’s grandfather it would have been reported. Yes, that would tear the family apart but the grandmother's betrayal is inexcusable.

The UK has had almost no prosecutions unlike France who doesn't tiptoe around caring about "cultural sensitivity"

TheBuffster · 06/03/2021 19:34

^The UK has had almost no prosecutions unlike France who doesn't tiptoe around caring about "cultural sensitivity"^

That's interesting. Do you know if prosecutions acted as any kind of deterrent in terms of numbers?

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TheBuffster · 06/03/2021 22:07

Those numbers and percentages are awful to imagine each one is a mutilated girl.

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PotholeParadies · 07/03/2021 21:37

www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/fgm-awareness-training-with-hibo-wardere-and-gina-sosa-tickets-144257765861

Hibo and a lecturer in midwifery are doing an online event for safeguarding professionals on how to identify and protect girls at risk of FGM.

TheBuffster · 08/03/2021 12:08

Thanks for the information everyone. Finished the book and I think it's a really important read.
Bump for international women's Day.
blackwells.co.uk/bookshop/product/9781471153983?gC=5a105e8b&gclid=Cj0KCQiAs5eCBhCBARIsAEhk4r4cmCBDCEEZYegREmgfE5poqKfcV4E8roOfdscYfZouA_-lO3yIPFoaAl_uEALw_wcB

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