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Original poster

Mumsnet says Trans Rights are Human Rights!

9 replies

ool0n · 03/03/2021 14:39

I always assumed Mumsnet were not the biggest supporters of trans rights, given the stories about them. But this is a good statement on Twitter, "of course trans people exist, and of course trans rights are human rights"
twitter.com/MumsnetTowers/status/1367071394870276099

Also I thought using terms like cisgender or cis were against the rules, this isn't true either -
twitter.com/MumsnetTowers/status/1367080005193318401

So can I get a trans rights are human rights, trans women are women, trans men are men and non binary people are valid!

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MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 03/03/2021 15:03

@BaronessWrongCrowd

Of course trans rights are human rights, why on earth wouldn't they be? Woman's rights are human rights as well. They are not the same.

Transmen are transmen, Transwomen are transwomen.

I don't get what you are trying to imply. Also please don't try and goad the board with TWAW because it doesn't wash on here.

Hello - just to be clear for any new posters - in terms of our Guidelines, TWAW is an entirely legitimate viewpoint and users are welcome to hold it and (if they wish) to make the arguments - think it's important to lay that out for anyone who's come over from Twitter (following MNHQ's offers to them) to see if we really do allow free and fair conversations about this.

For more about what we do and don't allow please check out our general Talk guidelines here and our specific guidelines on the trans, gender and sex issue here.

Thanks all

MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 03/03/2021 15:19

[quote bigotryisbad]@RowanMumsnet

It's not a great sign that MNHQ have to step in as the first mention that:

Trans women are women,
Trans men are men and
Non binary people are non binary.

Has @BaronessWrongCrowd making a threat that OP should not "goad the board with TWAW because it doesn't wash on here.".

In fact, it rather shows that the transphobia is endemic and accepted.

Although the racism from @PurpleHoodie was also something of a red flag.[/quote]
That post was deleted within three minutes (I checked)

We're stepping in to show that our invitations to take part in good faith were, in themselves, genuine and in good faith - and that we see it as part of MNHQ's job to make sure that all points of view, expressed within Guidelines, are welcome.

MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 03/03/2021 16:12

Hey - we love recipes (we host loads of 'em) but not so keen if recipe chat is a derailing tactic or a way to try to ensure that people with opposing views get frustrated and go away.

We also appreciate the love for the tasty, malty goodness of Soreen, obvs I can't eat it I'm on a diet

When we say we want people of all viewpoints to feel welcome to post here, we really do mean it. So we'd really appreciate it if recipe-chat wasn't used as a way to discourage people from posting. Thanks

MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 03/03/2021 16:22

[quote bigotryisbad]@RowanMumsnet

Thank you for deleting the racism so fast and for removing some of the many transphobic comments.

That several posters seem affronted at anyone non-transphobic posting, including:
@PheasantPlucker1
@tellmewhentheLangshiplandscoz
@BaronessWrongCrowd
@Leafstamp

On the other hand, is hardly 'welcoming debate'. In fact, it simply proves the point made earlier on twitter that MNHQ has become a 'safe space' for transphobia and bigoty and that anyone posting otherwise will be threatened, told to read the room or banned.[/quote]
Can't see any 'threatening' going on although of course please highlight if you think we've missed it. In all honesty this doesn't read as though you were intending to take part in a conversation in good faith - it reads more as though you were looking for ammo for Twitter? Nobody's been banned as far as I know. We welcome all voices is what we said - and we do (so long as they stick to Guidelines).

MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 03/03/2021 16:35

@CuriousaboutSamphire believe me I'm grouchy about just about everything Grin

In essence we're asking two groups of people who are absolutely at loggerheads to engage with each other in reasonably good faith here. It's difficult all round so we're just trying to keep a light-ish hand on the tiller and remind everyone that some things (deliberate derailing, not actually engaging, only here for the screenshots) are not going to help.

Obviously there will be plenty of people on both sides who have no interest in a good faith debate (although we can see lots of people on this thread are doing just that) but we at MNHQ are really committed to it and we're willing to do our bit.

MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 03/03/2021 16:42

@bigotryisbad This might be a genuine piece of miscommunication - our assertion that we welcome debate is our statement, as in MNHQ's (the mod team and the people who run the site). MN has about 8 million users a month - we really can't claim that all MN users agree with us on anything

MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 03/03/2021 16:53

@bigotryisbad Well, we obviously don't agree the opinions expressed here are transphobic (any more than we think your opinions are misogynist) because if we did we'd delete them.

One post - that, to reiterate, was deleted within three minutes - used a racist slur to make an ill-advised point about the legitimacy of using contentious language in a discussion about language. It was deleted immediately for the racist slur but it honestly feels like a very big reach to use that (on a thread of 250+ posts and counting) to characterise the response of MN users overall as 'racist'. Again - we'd ask you to do this in good faith. Because we are.

MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 03/03/2021 17:05

Thanks @bigotryisbad. I wasn't accusing you of misogyny to be clear. You may well be right about some aspects of systematic bias - it's doubtful that any organisation entirely avoids it I'd have thought and Mumsnet is used overwhelmingly by women and has a largely female staff so I'm sure we can't claim to be free of it on this issue and on many others. That's one of the reasons we genuinely like having a big and diverse crowd contributing to conversations.

MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 03/03/2021 17:37

@Sophoclesthefox

I know we’re not doing cake recipes, but I really hope you’ve got enough cake and/or gin to cope with this afternoons shift, Rowanmumsnet! Brew Cake
I'm doing the Fast800 (this is what happens when you help JustineMN do a Zoomchat with Michael Mosley) so NO CAKE AND NO BOOZE, man alive

Tbh this is the real reason we don't want you to post about recipes Grin

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