*Julie - teen girl raped by Paris firefighters - age of consent

[OhHolyJesus]

Julie Bindel writes brilliantly on this case of a vulnerable young girl being groomed by firefighters in Paris.

It's a horrible story so I share with a trigger warning, I don't know which bit is the worst part but this sounds like rough sex defence in the way that a man would excuse himself of any responsibility:

During questioning, two of the accused men admitted they had had “group sex” with Julie while on duty and wearing their uniforms. Another admitted a sexual act in a toilet cubicle of a Parisian hospital where Julie had been admitted, yet claimed to have not noticed that the child displayed any signs of vulnerability.*

The fact she was in hospital escaped him did it and that this is where he was when he committed a sex crime against a minor? Sick bastards, I hope they throw away the key but as with so many other similar crimes the victim will likely not see justice.

Anyway, it's an important challenge for the age of consent on its own, even without the emergency service grooming gang.

My thoughts are with this brave young girl.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/07/outrage-over-french-girls-case-sparks-demand-for-law-to-protect-minors?fbclid=IwAR1kLGEZBvIH8ytNW1inZ70PS65_d7IQwODfJ4GVfw7WB5HPX926m5ya1Rw

I read this, it is indeed shocking.
Perhaps even more shocking is the fact that there is no age of consent in France

That's grim.

Also the fact that in law it's only rape if there is proof the woman or girl fought back.

Oh god...what monsters. I hope they can rot in prison for a long, long time.

I need to go hug my DD.

@StillWeRise the age of consent is 15 in France.

yes, adult men going to a hospital to have sex with a child who is a patient, and claiming she was not vulnerable....I think can can all see through that BS

It's hard to prove rape. It's still disgusting regardless.

So many shocking things in this, poor child. I hadn’t known that there was no age of consent - and for them to set it at 13??? Just vile. It is hard to imagine how so many people are unable to grasp the concept of grooming.

Fucking hell, that’s awful.

How is this legal within Europe?

I can't even...

I... What? Aside from how awful the case is, how can there be no age of consent in France? I'm stunned. How on earth do they prosecute paedophilia in that case?

That poor girl. Those monsters took advantage of a truly vulnerable, frightened child. I can't believe that France, a country at the heart of the EU ,doesn't have an age of consent. It's disgusting and the fact those bastards got away with rape...

[quote Okki]@StillWeRise the age of consent is 15 in France. [/quote]
if you read the article linked it explains that while there were plans to introduce and age of consent at 15 in 2018 the law was not passed

I think that in the UK our laws (although not enforced but that's another story) around this are better than many and we assume other countries in Europe will be similar.

Eg I only found out when cologne happened that their rape law including fighting back, I think they've changed it now.

There was an article the other day about CSA in France I'll see if I can find it

www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-europe-55707613

There isn't an age of consent as such. Under 15 a child can be considered a sexual minor so anybody having sexual activity with them can be convicted of sexual infraction but not rape. I guess it's similar to England and Wales having a difference between rape for a child under 13 and unlawful sexual intercourse if the minor is aged between 13 and 15.

This was written in 2018 when the law was being considered for change.
Chillingly it suggests that the reason for their being no specific age is because of the idea that children have the right to be seen as sexual beings. An idea routed in paedophilia. And one we are frequently seeing again (Peter Tatchell has made remarks amongst others).
httpss://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2018/03/frances-existential-crisis-over-sexual-harassment-laws/550700/

the first article says the law on age of consent was not passed because the government said it would result in 'an assumption of guilt'. Which I suppose they mean like in the UK, there is no defence against sex with a minor, they wanted an adult to be able to feasibly defend themselves against a charge of sex with a minor.

I may be being incredibly naive here, but would the reason against the 2018 law being changed have something to do with not wanting to prosecute teens from sexual activity with eachother?

I know we have a problem here where teens have been placed on the sex offenders register for sharing consensual sexting.

In an ideal world we'd teach teens not to do this but teens like to push boundaries.

It just goes to show predators will take advantage of loopholes if they are there.

Poor girl.

The French veneer of civilisation is looking a bit thin with no age of consent.

There kinda is. It's just not automatically considered rape.

ARTICLE 227-25
(Act no. 98-468 of 17th June 1998 Article 18 Official Journal of 18th June 1998)
(Ordinance no. 2000-916 of 19 September 2000 Article 3 Official Journal of 22 September 2000 in force 1 January 2002)
The commission without violence, constraint, threat or surprise of a sexual offence by an adult on the person of a minor under fifteen years of age is punished by five years' imprisonment and a fine of €75,000.

@TheBuffster

I may be being incredibly naive here, but would the reason against the 2018 law being changed have something to do with not wanting to prosecute teens from sexual activity with eachother?

I know we have a problem here where teens have been placed on the sex offenders register for sharing consensual sexting.

In an ideal world we'd teach teens not to do this but teens like to push boundaries.

It just goes to show predators will take advantage of loopholes if they are there.

Poor girl.

Do we? Do we really?

How would the police even know?

Someone has to make a complaint, so someone has to see those images.
You could argue it's the parents and they are angry but that's a bit of a red herring.

When DD1 was at school in Paris, one of the teachers had a long standing relationship with one of the pupils and got her pregnant. The school effectively had their hands tied as the teacher hadn’t broken any laws - she was over 15, the age of consent, and they couldn’t sack him. They finally got him to leave, but he then went on to write a “novel” about their “romance”, to great acclaim, until people discovered it wasn’t fiction.

The legal side is incredibly fucked up in France.

I honestly don't know the details of such instances. It was just in some safeguarding training I did. Basically saying young people's use of technology outstripping the people who are meant to be protecting them was a problem.
I'm afraid it was anecdotal so I have no evidence, other than it was in official training so assume it has happened.

So basically their law is sex with and under 15 year old is ok, but not if you can prove the girl faught back? Against a grown man? Any young girl at any age has to prove this?