I dont identify as a woman

[Flapjak]

I dont identify as a woman , so how do i know i am one? How does any woman 'know' they are a woman and not a man
Well this is how i know i am a female / woman

• I have been referred to as a girl from earliest memories and woman since and have never been mistaken for a male
• was observed to be a girl from birth by doctors , midwives, parents due to genitals
• developed breasts and began periods during puberty
• am smaller than the average male
• am not as strong as the average male
• have more body fat, less muscle tissue than the average male
• have given birth which therefore indicates i also have a cervix, uterus, ovaries and ovum
• i wear size 4 shoes, i have yet to meet a male who is this size
• i have experienced rape, domestic abuse, stalked and too many sexual inappropriate behaviours from men during my teens and twenties to count
• i am always aware of the risk from males if walking home alone at night and i feel the same fear for my daughters

My experience of knowing that i am woman rather than a man is based on the material reality of my physical body and its differences to a male body ie smaller, weaker, and therefore more vulnerable to attack from a larger and stronger male. That my body has gone through, menstruation , childbirth and menopause. I dont know what a female thought or feeling is as i cant compare it to a thought or feeling of a male to know

So i really want to know how any male can claim that they feel or identify as a female when they were neither born with a female body nor have had the lived experience from birth of living with that body. How someone who has lived as a male from childhood to adulthood knows what is like to live in a female body

Exactly, OP.

Same
I identify as a star trek fan and a musicals fan.
But I am a woman, it's not a feeling it's a fact

Because some men know everything. Experts in everything. The little wimmins should sit down and listen.

Yes but organsations are changing policy, access to toilets, access to female prisons and womens refuges based on something that is bot based on reality. Gender dysphoria aside, as many trans identifying purport to not have any dysphoria

I agree to an extent. I think there is something to the idea that a post everything completely passing transsexual will experience some of the societal gendered expectations / stereotypes of the opposite sex. Many testimonials from trans men and defeats women for example discussing how much more seriously they were taken as men, and how much more sexist men around them became in men-only environments.

Of course transsexuals don’t really worry about the idea of “identify as”. They are concerned solely with doing everything by they can to be mistaken for a member of the opposite sex. And of course none of the physical realities will ever change completely. Even having a Neo-vagina is nothing like having a female reproductive system.

Nobody who after the age of fifteen or so identifies as a member of a different gender from the one they started out in life as, can have the experience of having grown up from infancy as a member of the other sex in all respects: the expectations placed upon them by society, casual sexual abuse if female, awareness of innate superiority if male, and so forth.

I feel the same, as in I don’t feel female except when my body reminds me - sex, pregnancy, periods etc. Mentally I’m more “male” in some ways than my DH. Otherwise I feel neutral “gendered”. My “female” expression is more of a consciously constructed version created to fit in/be considered attractive when younger. This pressure is much worse now. I’ve no idea if other women feel the same or if they actually do feel female beyond their biology. I have an autistic DD aged 10 and need to combat this narrative.

Same OP. I was what would be very much considered a tomboy up until puberty and although now grown I do like wearing makeup and some feminine clothes I don't feel that any of these things truly reflect that I am female, being female or male is just what your body is, the way you behave and your personal style are not as related to your sex as most people think they are. I know this isn't your main point but it's just part of what irritates me about the misuse of sex specific language. I have also experienced violence at the hands of a man and can understand why allowing males into female only spaces is a huge issue.

Yeah, I've seen "well, how do you know that you're a woman?" posed as a supposedly clever question by TRAs.

To which I would counter "The same way you know you're a human being, and not a giraffe".

I do feel female, by the way, but not in the sense of having a fluffy pink lady brain. Is it the fabled gender identity.... Or is just the fact that I am indeed a woman and happy to be one?

Because some men know everything. Experts in everything. The little wimmins should sit down and listen.

That is exactly what their statements boil down to!

Well no I don't either. It's not a part of my 'identity' at all.

I am one though.

I tick agender/ prefer not to say.

If the item doesn't ask sex as well then they don't know do they.

Why stuff can't ask sex and gender is telling. It's not about recognising trans people. It's about erasing women.

I don't identify as having a gender at all. I've never embraced gender stereotypes, never been a follower of fashion (well except for a brief infatuation with tartan due to the Bay City Rollers and some 6 inch silver platform boots - thanks glam rock - but actually neither of those were "women's fashions"), never been fussed with make-up etc.
If I can't reference biology as the reason I am a woman, then I have nothing on which to rest that part of my identity and my feeling of belonging to that class. But as long as those who see things differently are happy...

When I see adverts stating a job/service/class/event etc is for "anyone who identifies as a woman" then I assume it isn't for me. I don't "identify as", I simple am a woman. "Identity as" suggests a voluntary choice, which it isn't.

So as far as I can see, anyone using that phrase is asking for men.

When I see "anyone who identifies as a woman" I know it is a sexist role and I avoid. They don't need a woman because of something real. They want someone who will wear lipstick, cry easily and be submissive. They don't want any men who can be suitably weak.

That job should be advertised without reference to sex or gender. Advertise for the personality you want instead.

Nope, I genuinely do not understand what it means to 'identify as a woman' in a way that does not directly involve female biology.

If biology is taken out of the words man and woman and we rely solely on the genderism definitions of undefinable, internal feelings of how we relate to something that is 'largely culturally determined' (Stonewall) then I'm not a woman because I think the 'largely culturally determined' gender role forced upon females is oppressive bullshit and I definitely don't identify as it.

Yes strippedfridge and Notts, thats exactly how I feel. I have been planning to do voluntary work for some time and feel i cannot volunteer in a organisation to support women that welcomes 'anyone' that identifies as a woman. I would not have an issue if they stated transmen as regardless of how they identify now they are still female bodied people in regards to health, vulnerability etc. Personally i also woudnt also have as much of a concern if they also included trans women with a GRC for some limited roles, but no it seems that we have to take our chances that males that volunteer in womens services are all there for altruistic reasons.

Historically, and traditionally, many nascent young lesbians and gay males have felt from a young age that they were really the opposite sex - for the reason that they did not conform to the gendered expectations that were imposed on them by society at large,;or from their own families. This is the issue. Gender stereotypes and expectations around the 'performance of gender' and sexuality. What it means to be a woman or a man in society.

We really seem to have gone backwards. I get it that some people feel intense repulsion for their natural, sexed body. But this is a psychological issue, and not an indication that being born in the wrong body is a real thing ( Except in the mind of the afflicted) that can be remedied by contemporary surgical technique.

When you self consciously 'identify' as something, then a disproportionate amount of your time and energy is taken up with attempting to conform to what is expected of that particular role or identification.

It is true that some women do go all out for performing feminine gender - in that they also spend an inordinate amount of time each day on hair and make up etc. But should they cease to do this, or lose interest in it, they are still women, still female. Because being a woman is a biological denominator and not a fixed role or performance.

I always think there's a word missing: not 'I identify as a woman' but 'I identify myself as a woman.' That latter makes sense, and I do indeed do it, based on my understanding of English words, whenever I have to indicate my sex. But the former makes no sense; the construction 'I identify as...' in other contexts indicates a disputable and subjective statement, but there is nothing disputable or subjective about my reproductive plumbing.

We know we are women because we have learnt that woman is the word for people with our biology. Change the dictionaries and we wouldn't be any less female, we just wouldn't have a humanising noun any more.

Can confirm what PP says about how differently you're treated when you pass. I only ever did online; the main thing I noticed was being treated as an equal human by both sexes, as opposed to a brainless collection of subhuman parts (by males) or a freakish failure of femininity (by females).

If someone uses an ambiguous name on a board (think Pat, Mel, Kay) and doesn't say whether they are male or female, it is noticeable that almost everyone on such a board is quite sure which sex Pat/Mel/Kay is, but they don't agree with each other about it. Presumably such a person has a stripy or blotchy brain rather than a pink or a blue one, since the board members really can't tell which sex it is if they are not told. But reactions to their posts will be different depending on which sex they are believed to be.

If a person uses an obviously sexed name, such as Dave or Jane, they will be assumed to be of the sex their name is whether they are of that sex or not, and reactions to their posts will similarly be different depending on which sex they are assumed to be.

I don’t identify as a woman. I’m biologically female and my biology reminds me daily in many ways that I’m female.

I am however, identified by other people as a woman in many different areas like street harassment, sexual assault, my appearance being commented on either positively or negatively, my speech/demeanour/attitude is treated differently from men in personal and professional circumstances. I’m paid less (yes I’m challenging it) and on and on.

None of these things happen because of how I identify but because of how I have been identified. I can’t control that.