Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Update from Allison Bailey

38 replies

Imnobody4 · 17/01/2021 15:36

Preliminary Hearing is set for 11 & 12 Feb

twitter.com/BluskyeAllison/status/1350822872441376768?s=19

Seems like Stonewall and her Chambers are trying to hide behind redacted names and blaming each other.
Best of luck Allison, will have spade ready when necessary.

OP posts:
Biscuitsanddoombar · 19/01/2021 14:17

If it was Ruth Hunt I think she’s frankly talking rubbish. Ruth hunt here with sadiq Khan & munroe bergdorf. It’s completely obvious Ruth hunt despite their clothes is a woman, MB is a TW & sadiq Khan is a man

Update from Allison Bailey
SqueakyCarrots · 19/01/2021 14:30

I have such a poor memory for faces I can’t tell if that’s her or not from that pic. However whoever wrote it was very visabley female imo anyways, despite self description as a bitch lesbian. I’ve never actually met a ‘butch lesbian’ whose sex I was confused about, even before they spoke or I saw how they moved. So I had equal scepticism.

Also the worst violence the person claimed to have met was - at an Eddie Izzard performance no less (which had to be made up) someone shouted loudly that a man was going into the women’s loos. While some women may be uncomfortable at being referred to as a man I doubt any would term it violence or threatening. It’s a simple am I fuck. I doubt many ‘butch lesbians’ live in fear of being called a man (because of us bad bad women).

donquixotedelamancha · 19/01/2021 14:31

Stonewall et al may well exploit feelings of upset about the first to generate anxiety about the potential for the latter in order to garner support for the cause, they are incredibly cynical.

Very true. The idea that lesbians are being mistaken for transwomen because women are campaigning for single sex spaces is laughable.

stumbledin · 19/01/2021 14:52

Article re butch lesbians and toilets inews.co.uk/news/uk/butch-lesbian-public-toilet-women-abuse-government-review-gender-neutral-facilities-833787

This is obviously a strategically based article to sway consultation on toilets.

As someone who monitors news feeds (for volunteer work not mumsnet!) it is astonishing how every day there are well placed stories about the terrible time trans people are having and how it is all the fault of gender critical feminists.

So I know we celebrate when The Times or some other right wing paper prints a more pro sex rights article (thank goodness there are some!) but in terms of the daily news noise these are drowned out by the daily torrent of victimised trans stories.

It is very very disheartening.

OvaHere · 19/01/2021 14:53

I think people forget that real life encounters are not like photos. A while back I took my car to the garage. Stood to the right of me at the reception was a person in mechanics overalls and very cropped hair, at first glance my brain read male (no doubt a mental bias due to the setting I was in) but as soon as she moved and spoke it was plainly obvious she was a woman.

gardenbird48 · 19/01/2021 14:54

Accusations that butch lesbians have a tough time in women's loos and this will make it worse.

I wonder what her solution to this might be (RH, while being quite butch is unmistakably female) - do we a) make it clear that anyone that may or may not look like a man can use the women’s toilets, leaving the door wide open for abuse of all who are in there or b) repair the ‘social contract’ that she and people like her have damaged so much to say that all male people are excluded from women’s toilets, making it much safer to assume that the person who looks a bit butch is actually a woman which will be verified with a second glance at most.

I honestly can’t imagine mistaking any butch lesbians for a man. I have known many over the years and it is so obvious that they are just a butch version of female, not male.

gardenbird48 · 19/01/2021 15:11

Thanks for the article Stumbledin. This lady works for Stonewall and during the last two years has noticed a mysterious increase in her being challenged (sometimes by men seeing her go into the ladies) for using the women’s toilets.

I wonder if she can possibly think of why things might have changed over the last two years?? Could it have anything to do with Stonewall campaigning for male born people to use the ladies as well??

SqueakyCarrots · 19/01/2021 15:58

Yeah that’s it ty! Duno why I couldn’t find it when I looked for it again.

And yes re the strategicly placed articles- that’s why I wanted to mention it on this thread because it felt v much like that, and a fair bit felt like lies. Obviously I remembered the Eddie izzard part slightly wrong, but it doesn’t for a second sound believable that anyone at eddies performance would challenge anyone this claimed. It just feels false, and even when it comes to lies in print I think gut instinct is often right.

I found everything in the article very strategic. That the discussion is about her rights (it’s not it’s all women’s rights) that those of us arguing against self Id are the ones trampling over lesbians (because lesbians feel being confused for a man erasure but the cotton ceiling inclusive??) the call for disabled people, gcn women and trans people to fill in the consultation (but not us ‘feminine’ women) the idea any woman whose not ‘feminine’ is being challenged on entering toilets (because women who wear skirts, have long hair and wear make up do so 100% of the time...) and the idea that people can’t tell whose male or female because we all identify others on whether they fit the toilet pic with skirt or trousers (even a seconds confusion becomes obvious when someone talks or moves) or the idea that ‘butch’ women women would be confusing for us (tw are the ones who choose long hair, make up, skirts and heels because of their ‘inner female essence’ or whatever the fuck, so obviously it’s not butch women who are confusing anyone).

It read very much like scripted gas lighty head fuckery and felt very much placed to counter the cases calling out stonewalls lack of support/blatant betrayal. Feels very much like a slight of hand.

stumbledin · 19/01/2021 16:12

This lady works for Stonewall - haha - what a surprise!

I didn't even read the article. Just how deceitful is that. Newspapers are so lazy now. They take any old crap that they think makes them look in touch.

But they funny thing is they never take the press releases from women's groups. Angry

morningtoncrescent62 · 06/03/2021 09:47

There's another update this morning. Allison's published the text of the complaint by Stonewall, and her response to the complaint investigation by Garden Court. Available here: allisonbailey.co.uk/updates/update-5-breaking-exclusive/

Happinessisawarmcervix · 06/03/2021 09:52

The Stonewall email is an interesting read.

They complain Alison is accusing Stonewall of intimidation - in an email to her employers aimed at getting her disciplined. What is that if not intimidation!

But more concerning is the framing of opposition to Self-ID as “calling for trans people to lose their current legal rights”. I’ve seen this elsewhere and it’s StoneLaw at its finest, isn’t it!

Biscuitsanddoombar · 06/03/2021 09:57

Ah the lesser spotted trans legal rights

Many have referred to these trans legal rights being removed but no one can actually tell you what specifically these legal rights are that are (allegedly) being removed

Self ID is not a legal right & gender identity is not a protected characteristic

morningtoncrescent62 · 06/03/2021 11:37

I was rather struck by the allegation that "Ms Bailey has also chaired Woman's Pace meetings which is regarded by many LGBT rights and anti-violence organisations to be a hate group". Presumably this refers to Woman's Place UK, but the person sending the email couldn't actually be bothered to check the name of WPUK, let alone the assertion made about them. Why on earth would a legal chambers take seriously this sort of assertion? That unnamed 'anti-violence organisations' regard WPUK to be a hate group is in no way evidence that they are and I wouldn't expect any legal outfit to give such an allegation the time of day.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page
Swipe left for the next trending thread