Another consultation - Abortion Pills - deadline Feb 2021

[OhHolyJesus]

Consultation description
During the COVID-19 pandemic the government put in place a temporary measure in England, enabling women and girls to take both pills for early medical abortion (EMA) in their own homes up to 10 weeks’ (9 weeks and 6 days) gestation.

Before the pandemic, only the second pill for EMA could be taken at home ‒ women and girls attended an abortion service to take the first pill.

"The temporary measure has been put in place to reduce the risk of transmission of COVID-19 and ensure continued access to abortion services. It’s time limited for 2 years, or until the pandemic is over ‒ whichever is earliest.

The government is now seeking views on whether or not to make the temporary measure permanent."

www.gov.uk/government/consultations/home-use-of-both-pills-for-early-medical-abortion

Bumped and answered x

Thanks for sharing this. Maybe this could be one good thing to come out of this pandemic?

I've never had an abortion but I am terrified by the idea of having to walk past anti-abortion protesters and then have the horrible, painful experience on my own inside a bleak abortion clinic.

I really don't see why, in the very early stages of pregnancy, women shouldn't be allowed the dignity of doing this in their own homes.

Problem is you only have to take a cursory glance at the Pregnancy Choices board to see the amount of women posting because they've
Now regretted their decision and asking for advice about getting pregnant again - it's too easy to make a phone call and have them posted out to you within a few days with little to no discussion about whether this is something they 100% want to go through with

I've got to disagree with you there @ivfbeenbusy. Yes, some women will regret abortion, that will always be the case. But women are adults and they should be given the responsibility to make the decision themselves. I would far rather regret having an abortion than regret having a baby.

@carlaCox

I've got to disagree with you there *@ivfbeenbusy*. Yes, some women will regret abortion, that will always be the case. But women are adults and they should be given the responsibility to make the decision themselves. I would far rather regret having an abortion than regret having a baby.

What if the pregnancy happens in childhood? Is a child of fourteen, old enough to make a medical decision that they might one day regret?

Given that having an early abortion is considerably safer than having a baby (for any woman, let alone a 14 year old girl) judges correctly decided many years ago that a child of 14 can consent to abortion.

Unlike puberty blockers, the results of abortion are well known and well documented. It's also not an irreversible decision in that the child can go on to have children at a more appropriate age.

@Positrans any fourteen year old who is pregnant should be discussing this with professionals. For many, many reasons.

What if the pregnancy happens in childhood? Is a child of fourteen, old enough to make a medical decision that they might one day regret? Oooh! Is that a trick question?

Fraser guidelines! Post 2006 any fourteen year old will do as any adult woman would: discuss it fully with adult professionals before proceeding.

I think they should be available for women/girls if they want them.

WARNING FOR ANYONE SENSITIVE ON THE TOPIC OR SQUEAMISH TO NOT READ PAST HERE

Unsure if that was necessary, but can imagine my post might be a bit graphic for some from here on..

However, that said I have taken those pills before, at 16. I did it in a medical setting and for that I am so glad, the pain..now that I have been through labour, was actually worse than that. I was really ill. There was a lot of blood, and we had to pee in those sick trays you get in hospitals and leave it for a nurse to check so they could see if the material had came out or not..as we were not allowed to leave util it had as otherwise if it was retained more than a few hours apparently it could be very dangerous. There was a LOT of focus on making sure women did not leave until everything was gone, if anything it seemed the main focus rather than making sure we were ok tbh. Not to police women, but this part of it scares me a little, if it was true that its dangerous to not have everything out within a few hours? Yeah women can check this themselves, but are they told to? And would they even know what they were looking for? (like, tmi maybe but I thught I passed it all, but apparently it was only half of what needed to come ut?! Not sure how that works but they said that and yeah, an hour later a bunch more came so they were right)

All that said, still my main problem with it all was that the psychiatrist person was 'off' the day I took my pills, either of them though I was told its the first one thats actually important, and there is no going back after the first, like its no good changing your mind right before the second. but yeah, the mental health was NOT there. I dont think I would have made a different decision, but support wold have been good.

Maybe things have changed. Surely they must have, if its ok to do this at home now. Or the hospital I was at were very OTT or something? Not sure.

How ill women were on that day will never leave me. I did kind of go into it thinking it wuld be quiet easy and simple and got a shock. Could have been a bad day or something, not sure. But people were vomitting, passing out and so on. It seems dangerous to 'allow' this at home. At the same time, I don't feel right saying do not allow it, as a lot of women/girls might benefit from it. So final position is probably, allow it if its wanted tbh.

After writing all of this, I do wonder if maybe I was past 10 weeks? And its all a lot easier before 10 weeks? Its all a bit of a haze, but when I found out I was 7 weeks apparently, and things seemed to go very quickly from there. It seemed like it was all in a week, though I cannot be sure.

Given that having an early abortion is considerably safer than having a baby (for any woman, let alone a 14 year old girl) judges correctly decided many years ago that a child of 14 can consent to abortion.

Also yes, this.

Thats not quite the gotchya TRAs want it to be. At all.

I'm glad that Posit is now starting to think about children and medical procedures and informed consent etc - I hope you have found our previous threads helpful on this.

Obviously, consenting to this type of procedure is very different to the issue of puberty blockers with all their long term health effects for very little, if any benefit.

I don't think there is much thinking about children involved here to be honest, sadly. Its more along the lines of 'if children cannot consent to experimental treatments that give lifelong medical consequences and have no evidence base, then they cannot consent to any medical procedure at all can they, haha got you nasty feminists!' while simultaneously crowing about how Gillick competence and such is so important and apparently feminists (not those now whinging that 14 year olds can get abortions, as its not fair if 14 year olds cannot get sterilized and whatever other effects) are attacking that?! Its mind boggling really.

What if the pregnancy happens in childhood? Is a child of fourteen, old enough to make a medical decision that they might one day regret?

You spectacularly miss the point of the Keira Bell judgement. An abortion isn't experimental. ''Treating'' GD with puberty blockers is. The aim of an abortion is well understood, we know what the outcome will be, and the 14yo will have all the facts available to them unlike with puberty blockers where the aim of ''treatment'' changes to suit the latest made up narrative and no one knows what the full effects will be further down the line.

Continuing a pregnancy and giving birth as a child is a whole lot riskier than terminating. In many cases an abortion is in the best interest of the child. It can actually be life saving. Puberty blockers, according to the Tavistock's own study, are not, because rather than treat dysphoria, they prolong it and stop it resolving naturally in many cases. Who benefits from that? Certainly not the child who is turned into a lifelong medical patient...

An abortion won't leave the girl sexually defunct and infertile as an adult with crap bone density either.

Nice try though.

consult.gov.scot/population-health/early-medical-abortion-at-home/

Scottish consultation link

Thought I had posted this earlier but cant find it.

and without wishing to derail the discussion of the actual issue was disappointed in light of Liz Truss and her anti woke speech to see they include something along the line of it being about "people" who get pregnant!