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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Is there a healthcare plan for detransitioners?

28 replies

vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 09/12/2020 14:00

My friend of a friend's daughter is detranstioning. I don't know her very well, and certainly not her adult kid - but I was an HCP.

The person is 22, had a hysterectomy about 4 years ago. Stopped cross sex hormones about 2 years ago. Has terrible pelvic pain, and is generally distressed about her situation, she says she is grieving for the choices she made. She has a long history of mental health challenges.

She is looking for help with the pain, but, as far as I can see, there is no care pathway for detransitioners.

Is that right? It's a while since I worked in the NHS, but I can't think of any specific help I can direct her to.

OP posts:
OhHolyJesus · 09/12/2020 14:12

There isn't, it's a huge issue.

The Detransitioners Advocacy Network will help but the only other thing I can suggest is to write to Nadine Dorries and keep going.

This is a horrific story, I'm so sad for her.

I suppose she could argue medical negligence with the consent issue or with the service that guided her, if they didn't look into her mental health or comorbidities but that's a really hard road and one that doesn't alleviate her immediate pain.

She may not want to return to the service that transitioned her but could she go to her GP and try to get a referral? It's a service they should provide given the level of support for trans people, at the very minimum there should be the same for detransitioners.

This is awful, the poor girl.

baddaytoquitsmoking · 09/12/2020 15:05

There's nothing. Absolutely fuck all. And to add insult, when they attempt to access sexual health services they get signposted back to gender clinics.

This entire mess was not thought through.

Original poster
vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 09/12/2020 15:55

Thanks. It is a real problem, isn't it?

She has significant pain which I expect is related to vaginal atrophy/adhesions from surgery/general upset state of mind. A pain clinic will help, but, really, she is complex and traumatised - and they won't have experience of the trans issues.

I think you're right, the gender clinic is probably the place to start. It is, after all, where this group of patients are coming from so they have the most experience. And, they have a duty of care, even if there is no service yet there won't be one unless there is a demonstrable need.

She just wants her fertility and her tits back - and she can't have either.

OP posts:
OhHolyJesus · 09/12/2020 16:04

Is she seeing a therapist? I mean I realise that most affirm and so I don't know if they affirm destransitioning as they affirm transitioning but maybe there is a specialist she could talk to so to help her explore this.

I'm furious for her. I'd be seeing a medical negligence lawyer and kicking up Merry hell with any and all who would listen.

These poor kids.

She might feel so unable to trust the gender clinic that she will feel totally stuck and on her own. The Dutch study did reference how their less than 1% regret figure might be partly because previous patients don't return and seek help elsewhere (though the self ID crew daily to include that in their screenshots of the data).

It might not be the time but there are others like her to talk to, she is not alone.

GrandmaMazur · 09/12/2020 16:08

Someone recently posted a link with details of one of the ex-Tavistock psychologists - she might be able to help with counselling. I don’t have the details to hand but I’ll try and find them.

SophocIestheFox · 09/12/2020 16:14

Good lord my heart goes out to her. That is brutally young for a hysterectomy. I do think she needs a really good gynae/specialist pelvic physiotherapist to address the pelvic issues. Not sure if there is NHS provision for that, though Sad

rogdmum · 09/12/2020 16:14

Definitely put her in touch with the Detransitioners Advocacy Network. If she’s on social media, there are a lot of detransitioners on Twitter who seem to provide each other good support. DM me if you want some suggestions of people for her to follow/make contact with.

I’d also suggest she contact Hilary Cass to relate her experience (if she is up for it) as it would be really good for Dr Cass to hear the voices of detransitioners.

GrandmaMazur · 09/12/2020 16:14

@GrandmaMazur

Someone recently posted a link with details of one of the ex-Tavistock psychologists - she might be able to help with counselling. I don’t have the details to hand but I’ll try and find them.
She’s called Kirsty Entwistle - she wrote an open letter to the head of the Tavistock last year. Think she’s based in Portugal but does online therapy
Original poster
vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 09/12/2020 16:43

Thanks all, massively helpful.

To complicate things - she's in Australia. So, they appear to about to bring in a law that says criticising trans anything in any way is a crime. I can't see how she'd find a GC psychologist - I assume they are all worried of being struck off if they don't follow the party line.

I worked with pelvic physios in the UK and have put her in touch with some I know in Oz, but, they are all pronouned up - I did send them some stuff from here about detransitioning, and at least they are trans friendly and "get" inclusion and what not which is probably quite important for her.

Not sure that they'll "get" detransitioning, it flies in the face of everything they've been told. I can help with that, though. Got the rohypnol essay ready to send, amongst others.

Her whole world has evaporated. She was very involved in the trans community in Sydney, her work, volunteering, identity and social network have all gone when she realised she'd made a hideous mistake.

I could weep for her, I really could.

OP posts:
OhHolyJesus · 09/12/2020 16:51

Jesus OP that's tragic.

I know Senator Claire Chandler has spoken about sport but would it be possible for this young woman to contact her?

There must be a way to get her some help. Maybe even a private therapist in another country? It's all done online anyway so there must be someone she can talk to.

I'm afraid I have no connections or experience in Australia to offer any practical help.

OhHolyJesus · 09/12/2020 16:52

Sorry slight cross post.

She should contact Kirsty definitely!

rogdmum · 09/12/2020 16:54

If Australia, put her in contact with Roberto D’Angelo and Lost in Transition here: lostintransition.info/

rogdmum · 09/12/2020 16:55

Jay from Lost in Transition is also on Twitter as @Jay11L_

HecatesCatsInXmasHats · 09/12/2020 16:56

I'm so sad for her vivarium, I hope she can get some help with this. What a tragic situation.

ChakaDakotaRegina · 09/12/2020 20:37

[quote rogdmum]If Australia, put her in contact with Roberto D’Angelo and Lost in Transition here: lostintransition.info/[/quote]
Thanks for this - heart breaking
Transition didn’t help their mental health. After 10 years of living as male there is no legal way to go back to be a woman.

J4yL · 10/12/2020 01:17

Hello,

I am Jay from Lost in Transition. I also experience pelvic pain due to having a hysterectomy. I have been advised that it could be adhesions and that it would be best to see a gynaecologist to investigate the issue. Also, seeing a physio who specialises in pelvic health for pain management may aid in relief. I am happy to talk and be of support to her if that’s something she would be interested in.

SophocIestheFox · 10/12/2020 07:15

Hi Jay Smile

I’m so sorry that you are experiencing pelvic pain, and I hope you manage to find a gynae who can help. I have adhesions from a hyst, too, and while they’re not pleasant to live with, most of the time now it’s fine. Wishing you all the best.

imhereforthesanity · 10/12/2020 07:49

This has made me cry. So said that young people are being allowed (and encouraged IMO) to do this at an age, when one thinks they know everything, but really don't. She was 18 when she had a hysterectomy, thats insane, there are women in their 30's that know they don't want children that are discouraged from doing so, incase they change their mind - how on earth is it OK for young teens to make this decision. My heart goes out to her OP, and anyone else struggling with their identity and/or decisions they made in life as a result of. I'm 50 & I still wonder who the fuck I am sometimes - isn't that just part of the human condition - the young really have got caught up with this in a very damaging way.

RedToothBrush · 10/12/2020 07:54

There isnt one.

Partly because for the NHS to have one they have to, by default, admit negligence in carrying out treatment which causes harm.

As far as the NHS and other health care providers are concerned detransistioners don't exist.

Its appalling.

SnuggyBuggy · 10/12/2020 07:57

Oh but these people are such a tiny minority that we can just ignore them can't we?

Seriously it's grim and there is so much shit that is going to hit the fan one day. I hope she can get the help she needs to manage her pain and its fucking awful that most of the damage done to her is permanent.

TabbyTurmoil · 10/12/2020 09:25

If they can afford private therapy, I would suggest finding someone experienced in Acceptance and Commitment Therapy - likely to help with both the irreversible decisions and the pain.

thinkingaboutLangCleg · 10/12/2020 11:22

Surely the gender clinic would be the last place to seek help? They’re not going to admit they’ve harmed her (look at the Tavistock vs Keira), so they can’t offer help to alleviate that harm.

The detransitioners networks will surely give honest information. (Thanks, Jay, and best of luck to you as well.)

HecatesCatsInXmasHats · 10/12/2020 11:28

Jay Thanks

Original poster
vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 10/12/2020 14:32

That is great, thanks, Jay. You may already know each other! She is very down and her mother is worried that her mental health will take a hit without some support.

I'll send her your links - it's not my field, but I'd like to learn more so I'll see what the physios are up to. Hope your pain eases soon.

Thanks all, you have been very helpful.

OP posts:
J4yL · 11/12/2020 01:52

@vivariumvivariumsvivaria If you need help finding a good physio, I can put you in contact with someone who is able to assist you. They, themselves are a physio and can put you in contact with someone who specialises in working with pelvic health and those who have detransitioned. Let me know