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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Another excellent article from Spiked

28 replies

Campervan69 · 03/12/2020 17:56

www.spiked-online.com/2020/12/02/we-need-to-talk-about-ellen-page/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

"Do we matter? It seems not. The elitism of identitarianism is exposed in its commitment to overriding what society at large understands and believes, all those facts and customs we adhere to, and in its demand that we lie"

Talking of which, why are there no threads on this? Sure I saw one t'other day? Surely FWR hasn't been silenced.....

OP posts:
xxyzz · 06/12/2020 14:08

@MichelleofzeResistance

you probably shouldn't shout in the middle of a meeting "Hi Dave, I hear you used to be a man" as that would be cruel and unnecessary.

Definitely. You also probably shouldn't try to get someone fired on the grounds of having said something that threw doubt on your personal politics, exclude women from services for having intersectional issues that get in the way of your personal politics, call believing in reality a hate crime or threaten to rape and murder women for expressing views that contradict yours either, as also - well, cruel and unnecessary.

I know where you're coming from but I'd be much more sympathetic to the 'kind' thing if it was a sincerely held value that was extended impartially to all, but it isn't. When it's used in this context it's nothing more than a demand of service from one group who are expected to provide, to a group who appear to be in this context as perceived to have no reciprocal responsibilities at all. It reminds me of trying to persuade a kid that if you treat others harshly and roughly but demand perfect treatment be provided to you in turn - you're onto a loser. Essentially because not everyone is your mum, or is someone your mum has employed to pander to you with the sky falling if they fail to entertain and please you, or show you any consequences for your actions, or dare to suggest you're anything but a perfect and wonderful angel.

There's a lot of things potentially going on here, not least issues with empathy, theory of mind and respecting others being very visible in many representations from people speaking for this political lobby, particularly in viewing female others and children, as equally human. And very cynical use of language and marketing. But one of the big parts of the movement is, intentionally or not, moving towards the setting up of a counter elite. Those who get to say they feel unsafe and those who get told to get over it. Those who get to name their identity and those who better accept what others call them and shut up or (death threat). It appears to seek to divide society into the givers and the takers, with the choice of which you are certainly not being yours. There's nothing 'kind' about that. There's nothing foresighted about it either, with limited understanding of how people work under such circumstances.

Thank you, amazing post. I've always been implicitly aware of the power differential, but your post really brought it home.

It's all it is. A power play. Nothing more, nothing less. It's about putting women in their place and denying reality. Like 1984.

xxyzz · 06/12/2020 14:08

@MichelleofzeResistance

Oh and of course those who get to state what reality is, and those who must control their language and thoughts and actions to protect those others' personal experience, in denial of their own. In denial of their 'authentic selves'. With policed penalties for failing to do this right.

That isn't kind. It isn't even humane.

And this one too.
xxyzz · 06/12/2020 14:12

In a nutshell, you want me to 'be kind', you 'be kind' too. You want me to respect your rights and feelings, you respect my rights and feelings too.

If not, you are just demanding I bow to your power.

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