Norway criminalises 'transphobic' comments made in private

[DresdenChina]

Just posting this quickly so sorry if its already been discussed. Norway is now banning comments made in your own home with potential prison time for doing so.

It horrifies me how usually fairly sane Northern Euro cultures have embraced this, cannot wait for all the dobbing in your Mum and Dad cases.

www.reuters.com/article/norway-lgbt-lawmaking/norway-outlaws-hate-speech-against-trans-people-idUSKBN2852DL

It is funny how they are all going the same way - like there is a script or gameplan somewhere.

You mean like a big “how to” guide written by a law firm like Dentons? 🤔

Think about use cases, it's not going to be people having quiet GC chats at home, it'll be stuff like:
Kids wanting to transition using it against their "obstructive" parents.
Transitioning husbands using it against trans widows.

Do they have precedent for criminalising other hate speech used in private? Does this cover online comments?

Well family Christmas gathering will certainly have an edge this year!

Can we get the same for misogynistic remarks? If not, why not?

There isn't the same for racism, even private discussion of religious extremism in the home (which is banned in public place) is not banned.

Ask yourselves why? Why this one subject and no other?

And that tells you everything you need to know.

It's insane. Instilling fear, suppression and authoritarian control has never in history led to sparkling rainbows and happy ever after for anyone involved, especially not the group doing it.

Ask yourselves why? Why this one subject and no other?

I am asking, and I am still not sure. Maybe I'm being dim. Dismantling the idea of sex, isn't it? Disrupting families? Removing the idea and definition of 'woman' altogether ultimately removes the rights of women. I still don't understand why.

So how it will go down...

Mum can I go into town of Saturday night with Tom?
No you’re too young to be going off into town.
But I want to. Jane gets to go into town.
Well that’s her parent choice. I think at 12 you are too young...
Well... if you don’t let me, I’ll tell that you said @@@@##!!!!!

1984 indeed.

I can’t wait for them to start imprisoning women for saying they are not vulva owners, vagina smugglers, birthing parents, ciswomen and rebelling against the other inclusive words that exclude, you know, women.

No human rights movement is this authoritarian, or has such a disproportionate affect on the rights of other groups such as women and gay people.

Are there many trans people in positions of power and influence there? As opposed to women?

There is a little part of ancient me that hopes everyone who has transitioned (physically or mentally) gets to be fully and officially accepted as a woman in all words, thoughts and deeds.

If only to watch the scrabble to reclaim penises or want to be a man again when they realise just exactly how the rights of women are being depleted.

I woke up unusually early on Sunday. Put the tv on and there was a strange programme on about Finland. The general thrust seemed to be about how marvellous the government policy on trans issues is. It seems to be broadly self id for all, with the prime minister stating that anybody can declare themselves any gender and she would not have any right to an opinion. The focus was very much on transwomen.

Is misogyny treated the same?

Incredibly sinister. The gulags beckon.

Do they speak to their neighbours in Sweden, where the treatment of "trans" teenagers is being reined in as they wake up to the harms I wonder?

If Norwegian women are no longer allowed to mention their sex, perhaps we'd better do it for them. I'm inclined to buy a load of adult human female postcards, write "humans cannot change sex" on them and post them to MPs in Norway.

@ThatIsNotMyUsername

So how it will go down...

Mum can I go into town of Saturday night with Tom?
No you’re too young to be going off into town.
But I want to. Jane gets to go into town.
Well that’s her parent choice. I think at 12 you are too young...
Well... if you don’t let me, I’ll tell that you said @@@@##!!!!!

1984 indeed.

The Anti-sex Pro-gender League.

The lengths people will go to to police people's thoughts. Chilling.

That is terrifying. Please goddess we don't go the same way... may sense prevail.

Transitioning husbands using it against trans widows.

this is a horrific thought. But of course it will be used as a tool of domestic abuse. Any expression whatsoever of anger or displeasure or upset about the "transition" will be seen as dehumanising hate speech by some transitioning MtFs.

What a biased article. I would say that it was censored (no concrete examples or persuasive arguments against this law) except that the Thomson Reuters connection means Reuters likely wouldn't have made use of the freedom anyway...

Reuters may have no need to face readers directly, but news outlets in general are facing a crisis of reader faith. It doesn't help that one has to come to Mumsnet to a mention of freedom of speech, let alone suggestions upthread like:

Think about use cases, it's not going to be people having quiet GC chats at home, it'll be stuff like:
Kids wanting to transition using it against their "obstructive" parents.
Transitioning husbands using it against trans widows.

Why should we go to newspapers for "news", context, commentary, if they don't give any of that to us? Why should we pay?

Under the penal code, people charged with violent crimes can receive harsher sentences if a judge decides their actions were motivated by someone’s sexual orientation or gender identity.

And presumably, again, if it is (as so often is the case) because someone is a biological woman, no harsher sentences there...

That private comments lead to public pillorying, loss of reputation, sacking is well established. Try asking Carol Thatcher.

If it is actually codified as an offence, then it's less capricious

I'm not surprised a country with a reputation for minimising inequalities is looking at whether private remarks should be protected. Of course I do expect them to cover everything contained in their Equality laws (no idea of theirs - anyone know?)

We are heading back to the Salem witch hunts.

What do they mean by "private remarks" though?
That's a very half an article and wishy washy, doesn't actually say what it means - so the comments on here just seem to be speculating and scare mongering, I mean the article basically says sod all apart from "private remarks" which doesn't really explain anything.

I think it’s heading towards ‘she looked at me in a funny way...’