Transgender clinic linked to teen's suicide giving 12-year-olds puberty blockers

[PronounssheRa]

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/transgender-clinic-linked-teens-suicide-22824548

So this is the Mirror article about gender gp

'An undercover reporter approached the firm posing as the mum of a fictional 12-year-old named Scarlet who wanted to transition.'

'We were told Scarlet could be given puberty blockers within three weeks following a one-hour consultation with a therapist – without a follow-up appointment in person.'

Puberty blockers for a 12 year old after 1 appointment.

I recently got called a transphone on Twitter for saying I supported the GPhC for investigating Clear Chemist. As a pharmacist this legal loophole concerns me greatly.

At risk of poking the bear I will say my views regarding trans people don’t align with some on this site and I have no issue with children accessing puberty blockers and gender services provided they meet the Gillick competence requirements and that the treatment is accessed via face to face appointments with qualified specialists either within the NHS or private sector.

I do not support a service that is essentially the black market. Doctors who have been struck off in the UK have no business prescribing abroad then using an online pharmacy to aid and abet them. I really hope this loophole is closed soon. Allowing Clear Chemist to continue sets a dangerous president for anyone who wishes to bypass the regulatory system.

From what I can see too the GPhC hasn’t actually imposed any sanctions on Clear Chemist, they said they would investigate and the pharmacy shat themselves at the thought of the regulators sniffing around and stopped providing the service. This should be a massive red flag! Both GenderGP and Clear Chemist are profiteering from peoples desperation, they aren’t the white knights they are being made out to be by some.

That’s my two pennies worth anyway. Happy to discuss and learn.

I have no issue with children accessing puberty blockers and gender services provided they meet the Gillick competence requirements and that the treatment is accessed via face to face appointments with qualified specialists either within the NHS or private sector.

And after listening to the defence at Keira Bells case, do you feel absolutely confident that even Tavistock is thoroughly assessing these children? When the defence barrister also uses children of 12 having sex as a guidance to competence?

The answer is I’m honestly not sure. Implementation of the Gillick/Fraser rules relies on the experience and judgement of the healthcare professional at the time and each case will wildly differ. This will always be somewhat subjective, I for example I might use the guidelines to make a decision to supply emergency hormonal contraceptives to a 13 year old (perfectly allowed), someone else may deem this inappropriate and each case is unique.

I don’t think one case means the whole system is unfit for purpose and I’m worried about the implications this case may have on future use of the guidelines regarding young people and consent to medical treatment.

But I absolutely believe in proper regulation in healthcare. If a provider is acting inappropriately then they should be reprimanded. I also don’t think you can assess competence properly online, it should always be face to face.

I think TrufflyPig is highlighting an important point. Even if we disagree about treatment pathways we can agree that the supply of these drugs via an offshore provider is not appropriate. These drugs should be part of a properly monitored treatment programme not available via the internet from a company linked to a GP who has been suspended.

Yes Chaz, we can all agree to disagree on many things but I think we should all be in agreement that medical treatment of any kind must be safe and well regulated.

I tried to make this point on twitter but was pretty much told either I must support unregulated internet healthcare or else I’m a raging transphobe. I don’t think my opinions are mutually exclusive though, am I missing something there?

There is no doubt at all that any of this care needs to be done by a fully accredited clinic and not by one that has a history such as Gender GP.

However, I have felt my confidence in a child getting appropriate options via NHS for treatment also shaken.

And that there is scaremongering about contraception that may lead to aspects of the prescription of someone so young of puberty blockers being minimized. That the Tavistock has stated that a child who knows what an erection is and the mechanics of sex is deemed knowledgeable and experienced enough to sign away their right to pleasure and orgasm in sex and to have future children does merit much further exploration, in my opinion. That and the release of their proof that the affirmation only model is working long term ie. Do a rigorous follow up research project of transitioners.

Not sure if you are missing much truffly. You maybe seeing the purity spiral in action though.

Excuse my ignorance Wine but what exactly is the purity spiral?

It means that if you question something that very reasonably concerns you but does not fit the narrative you are labeled as hateful.

I have seen it happen regularly on twitter. Including to trans people themselves.

This will always be somewhat subjective, I for example I might use the guidelines to make a decision to supply emergency hormonal contraceptives to a 13 year old (perfectly allowed), someone else may deem this inappropriate and each case is unique.

But do you honestly think that prescribing a child hormone blockers to stall their normally developing puberty completely, a use which they are not actually licenced, a use which hasnt been properly researched and which experts are not actually sure of the outcomes of, a use which may not be reversible, which could prevent a child from ever going through puberty if they then go on to cross sex hormones (which they nearly all do), which could stop a human's brain from going through the vital developmental stages of puberty, make them permanently infertile and so on... You think that is in any way comparable to prescribing a 13 year old the Pill?

Yes Wine, that sounded very much like what happened. I don’t know why it bothered me so much but it did.

It’s the moment when you realise there is no scope for reasoned debate!

This is where the spiral leads
mirandayardley.com/en/when-a-transsexual-is-prosecuted-for-transgender-hate-crime/

Last week on the Keira Bell thread, someone linked to concerns a whistleblower (I think it was a WB?) had about a man she suspected was a paedophile trying to get blockers for his daughter.

If this place is prescribing them without even meeting the child or parent in person, how on Earth are they going to prevent situations like that? A child that is being abused may be terrified and will go along with what they're told to go along with. It's sickening to think about.

It wasn’t meant as a direct comparison Knights I was trying to highlight how the implementation of the guidelines may vary between healthcare providers and internal bias can creep into it even though it shouldn’t.