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Original poster

Dismissed while pregnant

33 replies

Mpolyakova · 01/10/2020 01:03

Ladies,

I was dismissed without warning yesterday on the grounds of poor performance just weeks before 2-year anniversary with the employer.
No discussions took place in advance. I mentioned that I'm very early in my pregnancy but was told it would not be taken into consideration.

I was also told I had no right to appeal.
This is so stressful and it looks like I cannot do anything about it.

Anyone has any experience in raising objections against employer in such circumstances?

OP posts:
60sPony · 01/10/2020 01:38

Check out the charity pregnant then screwed - they should be able to offer advice

luceloop · 01/10/2020 01:44

Did you actually do anything wrong for them to say you poorly performed?

cabbageking · 01/10/2020 01:50

You can appeal if it is pregnancy discrimination regardless.
Do you will have had some other feedback along the way about poor performance, support being offered, targets and time frame, warnings or disciplinaries or it did come out of the blue?

cabbageking · 01/10/2020 01:51

Sorry Did you have. Not the gobbledygook I typed

WeNo · 01/10/2020 01:55

This is definitely unfair dismissal. If it's around 'poor performance' they have to prove they gave you a warning, helped you to improve and document the process.

I'm guessing this is a small company with a small or no HR team? I know companies can't make you redundant if you're on maternity leave (unless the whole company goes under) and I think the same applies for pregnant women, but I'm not sure about dismissal.

At a previous company I worked for, we struggled to get rid of someone who was defrauding the company and following protocol took months so your employer must be lying if they think it's that easy to let you go!

Sorry, I'm not sure where to get advice but pp has suggested a charity and there's always citizens advice bureau. If you have grounds for unfair dismissal then you should get a pay out. Good luck x

JM10 · 01/10/2020 02:03

Did you tell them you were pregnant before or after? I don't know if this makes a difference, but presumably if they didn't know then they aren't getting rid of you because if the pregnancy.

DidoLamenting · 01/10/2020 04:41

@WeNo

This is definitely unfair dismissal. If it's around 'poor performance' they have to prove they gave you a warning, helped you to improve and document the process.

I'm guessing this is a small company with a small or no HR team? I know companies can't make you redundant if you're on maternity leave (unless the whole company goes under) and I think the same applies for pregnant women, but I'm not sure about dismissal.

At a previous company I worked for, we struggled to get rid of someone who was defrauding the company and following protocol took months so your employer must be lying if they think it's that easy to let you go!

Sorry, I'm not sure where to get advice but pp has suggested a charity and there's always citizens advice bureau. If you have grounds for unfair dismissal then you should get a pay out. Good luck x

This advice is not correct if an employee has less than 2 years employment. If the poster told her employer she was pregnant and they then dismissed her it would be an unfair dismissal but not if she only told them afterwards.
PopsicleHustler · 01/10/2020 04:47

Wait.....

There's a charity called pregnant and screwed??????!!!!!

FredaFox · 01/10/2020 04:47

You can be made redundant while pregnant please disregard pp advice @DidoLamenting is correct in her response

DidoLamenting · 01/10/2020 04:52

An employee with less than 2 years employment may have a contractual breach of contract claim if dismissed without the requisite notice period. Damages would be the pay for the notice period.

If the dismissal is due to discrimination because of a protected characteristic there is a possibility of an unfair dismissal claim. There are other limited grounds where 2 years service is not needed for a claim e.g political views. In the absence of these an employee can be dismissed before the 2 years are up and the dismissal will not in law be unfair.

DidoLamenting · 01/10/2020 04:55

@JM10

Did you tell them you were pregnant before or after? I don't know if this makes a difference, but presumably if they didn't know then they aren't getting rid of you because if the pregnancy.
It makes a difference. Pregnancy is a protected characteristic and dismissal on that ground would be unfair even without 2 years service. But if they didn’t know then OP wasn't dismissed for that reason.
LukewarmCustard · 01/10/2020 06:42

Mumsnet is running an online clinic with the charity Maternity Action this week. Their lawyers are experts on pregnancy and maternity at work and can answer your questions. Link is www.mumsnet.com/Talk/employment_issues/4026809-MNHQ-here-A-new-FREE-legal-advice-clinic-from-Maternity-Action-about-pregnancy-maternity-or-parental-issues-at-work

SD1978 · 01/10/2020 06:52

It's not clear from your OP if the pregnancy was mentioned before the meeting or during. If during, it has no bearing, and if before, have their been any performance reviews or meetings stating you're not performing to standard?

IndecentFeminist · 01/10/2020 06:56

It sounds like they didn't know you were pregnant when they fired you, so that isn't relevant. Within 2 years they don't need to go through any lengthy process.

PivotPivott · 01/10/2020 07:20

If they knew you were pregnant you could go down the route of unfair dismissal. If you only told them when you were getting the warning then they haven't dismissed you unfairly as they did not know.

WeNo · 02/10/2020 05:53

@FredaFox and @DidoLamenting, I was referring to the fact OP's perceived poor performance was not managed properly, nothing to do with whether she had told them she was pregnant before or after. Her employer should have given her a warning and a chance to improve. However, I've just looked it up and that only applies if she's been there over two years :(
Dismissal for being pregnant is unfair from day one of employment so it depends when OP told them.

Hopefully OP got some good advice from Maternity Action... perfect timing for the collaboration with MN.

Dunnowhat2do · 02/10/2020 06:18

I found ACAS helpful. Give them a call, they will tell you your rights regarding dismissal. Also I imagine your contract would have a process in which they dismiss people (disciplinary, final warning and dismissal) so perhaps take a look at that before you speak to ACAS if you choose to do so.

Given you're 2 weeks away from your 2 year anniversary, you're not entitled to redundancy. I've been there and yes it sucks, but I'd be more concerned with how they handled the dismissal

If they didn't know you were pregnant before then you shouldn't use that as a basis for dismissal.

Dunnowhat2do · 02/10/2020 06:21

also if you told them verbally, there is no proof. Always communicate on email - so have the chat and then follow up with something like "dear X, thanks for your time this morning/afternoon. Following on from my informing you of my pregnancy, please can you advise next steps relating to HR processes? Regards,X).

That starts a paper trail and then you would have grounds for thinking it was because you're pregnant.

DidoLamenting · 02/10/2020 13:42

[quote WeNo]**@FredaFox* and @DidoLamenting*, I was referring to the fact OP's perceived poor performance was not managed properly, nothing to do with whether she had told them she was pregnant before or after. Her employer should have given her a warning and a chance to improve. However, I've just looked it up and that only applies if she's been there over two years :(
Dismissal for being pregnant is unfair from day one of employment so it depends when OP told them.

Hopefully OP got some good advice from Maternity Action... perfect timing for the collaboration with MN.[/quote]
Your advice was wrong. There is no obligation to enter into discussions about performance/ issue warnings etc. if the employee has less than 2 year's service. Whether the situation was "not managed properly" is irrelevant.

The point about pregnancy has already been covered by me so I'm not quite sure why you feel the need to tell me what I've already said.

DidoLamenting · 02/10/2020 13:49

@Dunnowhat2do

I found ACAS helpful. Give them a call, they will tell you your rights regarding dismissal. Also I imagine your contract would have a process in which they dismiss people (disciplinary, final warning and dismissal) so perhaps take a look at that before you speak to ACAS if you choose to do so.

Given you're 2 weeks away from your 2 year anniversary, you're not entitled to redundancy. I've been there and yes it sucks, but I'd be more concerned with how they handled the dismissal

If they didn't know you were pregnant before then you shouldn't use that as a basis for dismissal.

Redundancy is not the same as dismissal. The OP has been dismissed due to poor performance. Redundancy is a very specific procedure with its own rules.

An employer is entitled to dismiss an employee if they have less than 2 years service. That dismissal is not unfair in law even if it might be unfair in layman's terms.

There are certain limited circumstances where a dismissal might be unfair in law despite the employee having less than 2 years service- one of which is pregnancy.

If the employer did not know the OP was pregnant (or if none of the other limited exceptions apply) her employer can be as unfair as they like without being "unfair".

deydododatdodontdeydo · 02/10/2020 14:08

As others have said, less than two years they don't need to follow any procedures for poor performance.
If you told them you were pregnant and they sacked you, you may have a case if you can prove it.

stumbledin · 02/10/2020 14:58

If you have not previously had any comments about your work performance, ie suggestions that you need to improve and some sort of time scale, then it would be unfair dismissal - except for the just under 2 years. Do you have a written contract? What does it say?

Does your employer have a history of getting rid of people just before they reach their 2 years? Would seem this is a common sharp practice.

In an ideal world if you were in a union you could get representation.

You could contact Citizen's Advice www.citizensadvice.org.uk/work/leaving-a-job/dismissal/check-if-your-dismissal-is-fair/

Depending on where you live there may be a local Law Centre that could give you advice - see www.lawcentres.org.uk/i-am-looking-for-advice

If this came up after you told them about being pregnant then in addition to above:

Maternity Action maternityaction.org.uk/get-free-advice/

Pregnant then Screwed pregnantthenscrewed.com/how-does-the-advice-line-work/

Original poster
Mpolyakova · 07/10/2020 21:28

It was out of the blue ...I'm distraught

OP posts:
LouHotel · 07/10/2020 21:41

OP did they know you were pregnant or have they reason to suspect you were?

Eg: small office, frequent bathroom breaks, sickness ect...

Original poster
Mpolyakova · 07/10/2020 21:59

Thank you ! On the contrary, it's a large multinational organisation. I spoke to a couple of lawyers and all of them said that there is not much you can do before the 2- year mark with particular employer

OP posts: