Discussions with DS's scout troop

[Chrysanthemum5]

Hi all
So I had a census form for DS's scout troop (sent on behalf of the Scouts Association) which asked about gender identity, ethnicity, and additional needs. I spoke to the troop to ask what the aim of the census was, and it were to check Scouts is meeting its requirements under the Equality Act then it needs to use the protected characteristics.

This has clearly sparked some thoughts amongst the leaders, and I've just had a chat with them about the Scouts policy (and the girl guides policies as I also have a DD). Turns out they have been worrying about things since they were given a copy of "Irreversible Damage: The Transgender Craze Seducing Our Daughters" by Abigail Shrier. They had also been following the current case against guides by a leader - and feel that leader has been treated very badly for trying to maintain safeguarding.

I've explained about Stonewall misrepresenting the law etc., and advised them to check with the Scouts association and get written confirmation that they have had proper legal advice, and that their insurers have been made aware of Scout policies.

Feeling like some progress is being made!

Well done. I really think the walls are crumbling.

Wow, is this official good news week?! I can’t recall such a rush of positive news stories for ages. It must be gathering momentum- the dam is about to break! Not before bloody time, and well done to all the hard working feminists who have got us to this point.

Well done OP. Yes, that sounds encouraging, though wtf were they thinking with 'gender identity' but not sex in the first place? By all means have both (if it's not something where only protected characteristics are actually relevant).

@KatieAlcock might be interested in this thread.

Yes, it feels very positive. The leader was concerned with his responsibilities towards the scouts in his care, and didn't seem to feel supported by Scout Association policies. My concern is that when this inevitably goes wrong, it is the leaders (in Scouts and Guides) who will be left with the blame - and they are all volunteers who are doing their best to give children a great and supportive environment.

You are right it will be the volunteer leaders in Scouts and Guides who are blamed and find themselves in the firing line when it all goes wrong. They already feel unsupported, it will be even worse when the proverbial hits the fan as those directly responsible for these policies will just throw them to the wolves. All leaders need to have clear written confirmation from the Association that these policies come from them and that they are responsible and accountable for them. Leaders need to cover themselves because this will implode.

As a Cub leader, my biggest fear is having to deal with this issue. I keep quiet publically on my thoughts as I want to be in the organisation to be a voice for the girls if it does occur, but know some of my fellow leaders are well meaning but slightly short sighted on these issues.

Dh is a Cub and Scout Leader. A year or two ago he said "The day I have to support a female Cub or Scout in wearing a binder - I leave." So certainly Leaders do not all agree with this. But the only reason he was aware that something like that could ever happen was that I had been showing him what was happening compared to what the law actually was.

Well done, OP!

Just to say I've tried raising this with the scout association several times.
They have removed the dangerous anti safeguarding stuff that was about but still point to stonewall and mermaids for advice.

This is what I get back
^
As an inclusive movement, we signpost to leading support organisations for young people across diversity and inclusion.^

At Scouts we want all young people to feel included and to have access to spaces as well as opportunities.

We actively engage with members of diverse communities as well as other organisations in the youth sector to support us with useful signposting and resources.

We review the information on our website regularly to make sure it is relevant, accurate and safe.

Big brush off.

It will only
Change if more leaders raise the issue.

With the original advice on binders I said that my risk assessment would prohibit a child wearing one from all activities because they were too dangerous.

Well done and well done those leaders but I vividly recall my diversity scout leader training many years ago where the trainers idea of making activities suitable for girls was to pinkify everything. I pushed back but got nowhere. At the time I thought it was a rather strange leader who clearly didn't interact with females much. I now wonder if he was following scout association materials.
I stopped being a leader over concerns about Scout Association safeguarding priorities