Times article Stop forcing stereotypes onto girls

[BovaryX]

I couldn't see this posted, will remove if there is existing thread. There is an article in the Times which states in light of new guidelines, teachers are not to use regressive gender stereotypes and allow girls and boys to play however they like without assuming they are 'trans.' It says that the guidelines are maybe a response to advice from a certain charity.

Girls who dress or play in ways that could be considered tomboyish should not be told that they may have a different gender identity, teachers have been instructed. Guidelines issued to schools by the government on Friday stated that boys and girls should never be led to believe that their preferences mean that their personalities or their bodies are wrong.The guidance, published by the Department for Education and Skills, has been altered since last year, when it simply stated: “Gender identity should be explored at a timely point and in a clear, sensitive and respectful manner.”

Is it just me or does Jo M contradict himself here ? He says something like it’s a myth that kids are being pushed into psychological treatment , drugs and then surgery. But... he then goes onto lament that due to a lack of resources trans kids wait years for their first psychological appointment and evaluation for (reversible) puberty blockers. So it’s a myth that trans kids are set on a medical pathway but it’s also terrible that kids take ages to be set on the medical pathway? And no , adding “reversible” in parenthesis doesn’t make matters better - drugs are drugs.

I think the big issue is the trans movement is all over the place in terms of how they conceptualise what trans even is. If kids have a terrible condition that if left untreated will put them through the “wrong puberty” with a high suicide risk then yeah , the medical model seems great - get them their life saving treatment. Of course if you accept that model you can’t at the same time say it’s a nasty gender crit lie that kids are getting drugs - that’s the whole point. Activists like jo M seem to want to get trans kids the “medical care” they “need” while at the same time deny it’s a medical condition- it’s just an identity , like being gay. These are mutually incompatible positions. Either kids bodies are fine the way they are or they are not.

I’d like to hear from mermaids what they are doing with all the money that’s been shoved their way. They keep insisting they haven’t done the things we said they did. OK then, tell us what you have been doing

Very good point, Kit19. Mermaids has accepted an awful lot of money over the years, including public money. Where has it gone?

The way they said “England and Wales”-they must be active in Scotland then?

I agree with a PP. There is no such thing as a trans gender child. Mermaids rely upon such a thing. They exist to promote gender as a real thing. But without gender there is no trans gender. And the schools’ guidance seems to be saying gender is all a bit silly. So what’s the point in Mermaids now then?

FindTheTruth I don’t think mainstream exposure of this will help girls like my daughter who use “being seen as a boy” as a protective cloak and are pretty deep into it now, but I think it will stem the number of girls in future who turn to it if it’s taken out of schools. And I think it will help any “ROGD” girls who come out of it in a few years time to understand how they were influenced.

The way they said “England and Wales”-they must be active in Scotland then?

Ah, now, that is a point, charities are not cross-border. There is a separate register of Scottish charities, OSCR, and Mermaids don’t appear to be on it. Which presumably means they cannot operate in Scotland.

The way they said “England and Wales”-they must be active in Scotland then?
Scotland has already withdrawn guidance (delivered by LGBT Scotland).
Equalities secretary Shirley-Anne Sommerville said at the time: "The complexity of these issues mean valid concerns have been raised. The Scottish Government recognises that in taking the unarguably good general principle of inclusivity, and developing specific recommendations, the approach risks potentially excluding other girls from female-only spaces. That cannot be right.”
There's a bit more about it here. www.transgendertrend.com/scotland-u-turn-transgender-schools-guidance-england-and-wales/

@Gncq

Mermaids as an idea is a good one

Trans children are an adult experiment.

The very concept that children can be trans is abusive to children.

Applauds

@Kit19

I’d like to hear from mermaids what they are doing with all the money that’s been shoved their way

They keep insisting they haven’t done the things we said they did

OK then, tell us what you have been doing

You could just read their annual report.

Mermaids received an income of £715,000 in the most recent period. Over £500,000 of this came from private donations, reflecting the success of the hbomb strream mostly. They employ 7 people with none paid in excess of £60,000 a year.

According to their annual report they delivered 138 training sessions over the year. Some of these were to teachers under a small grant from the DfE to combat transphobic bullying in schools. The total of the grant was £16,000. This is the only government funding Mermaids recieved during the period. The largest expenditure was the helpline they run. Second was training, on which they spent £100k, a large part of this probably the salary of the newly appointed training manager and developing materials given the low number of sessions delivered. They also ran a residential and spent £65,000 on awareness raising and £76,000 on campaigning.

The lottery grant, worth £100k a year presumably hasn't kicked in yet, and as a new organisation will be very tightly monitored. This grant is to set up a network of local support groups for trans kids, and they intend to employ four people to develop that.

So that's what they're up to. They are a registered charity it's pretty easy to check. The comparisons with Kids Company some have made, who had an annual income of £25 million and 500 employees, are a bit silly.

Funny how we actually had this on the 70s and 80s (and beyond). We somewhere lost the actual message that it’s ok for a boy to play with dollies and a girl to play rugby - it doesn’t make them in need of therapy.

My sister was the ultimate Candidate - boys: clothes, haircut, glasses, toys... even a boys name when we played. This was the 70s and no one ever proposed therapy or hormones or calling her ‘he’ or by a boys name. Mum and dad just got her what she wanted and didn’t draw the line at anything (as long as it wasn’t dangerous, why not give her the toys she wanted?).

I was at school with a boy who was very ‘girly’ - from day one of primary. As we grew up everyone assumed he was gay, he just got on with his life, left school and... eventually popped up on social media, married (to a woman) and the dad to a lot of kids. ‘And you all thought I was gay!’ He said. I don’t think he was bi, just a boy who liked to play with the girls, wasn’t macho and didn’t care to hide the fact that he liked ‘girls things’.

How did we allow this to happen?

Oh this is how... “received an income of £xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx...”

The way they said “England and Wales”-they must be active in Scotland then?

Scotland has already withdrawn guidance (delivered by LGBT Scotland).

Mermaids may not be so prominent in Scotland, but yes, they are here. In fact, they even provided training to civil servants at the Scottish Parliament - including the ones who wrote the GRA consultation. See this tweet for a pic of Susie Green sitting next to Leslie Evans (Permanent Secretary, the one who cost the taxpayer £500K over the Alex Salmond case).
twitter.com/caithness_pf/status/1193934803860672513

And the LGBT Youth schools guidance has NOT been withdrawn. Is was supposed to be replaced by December last year, and we are still waiting. The Education Minister has refused to withdraw it.

Mermaids are not a registered charity in Scotland though and should not be doing this without registering.

@thinkingaboutLangCleg

I’d like to hear from mermaids what they are doing with all the money that’s been shoved their way. They keep insisting they haven’t done the things we said they did. OK then, tell us what you have been doing

Very good point, Kit19. Mermaids has accepted an awful lot of money over the years, including public money. Where has it gone?

yes what did they do with the $340 000 from the gamer?

Why not read their annual report and you'll find out.

Yes, because they are straight as a ruler in all things...

@SerenityNowwwww

Yes, because they are straight as a ruler in all things...

Are you really suggesting both Mermaids and their accountants are lying in their annual report?

I suspect Mermaids will come under increasing scrutiny. They had the appalling data breach, are currently openly claiming not to have said / meant things that evidence demonstrates they did say, were severely criticised by a judge for their behaviour when 'working' with a mother determined to 'trans ' her very young son while everyone around the boy was clear that he did not want to be a girl. And that's just off the top of my head.

When you look back you wonder how they got away with any of it

@jj1968

Why not read their annual report and you'll find out.

well interestingly enough I had t o go to the Charity commissioners to have a look.

register-of-charities.charitycommission.gov.uk/charity-search?p_p_id=uk_gov_ccew_onereg_charitydetails_web_portlet_CharityDetailsPortlet&p_p_lifecycle=2&p_p_state=maximized&p_p_mode=view&p_p_resource_id=%2Faccounts-resource&p_p_cacheability=cacheLevelPage&_uk_gov_ccew_onereg_charitydetails_web_portlet_CharityDetailsPortlet_fileName=0001160575_AC_20190331_E_C.pdf&_uk_gov_ccew_onereg_charitydetails_web_portlet_CharityDetailsPortlet_objectiveId=A9839377&_uk_gov_ccew_onereg_charitydetails_web_portlet_CharityDetailsPortlet_priv_r_p_mvcRenderCommandName=%2Faccounts-and-annual-returns&_uk_gov_ccew_onereg_charitydetails_web_portlet_CharityDetailsPortlet_priv_r_p_LIFERAY_SHARED_backToSearch=https%3A%2F%2Fregister-of-charities.charitycommission.gov.uk%2Fcharity-search%3Fp_p_id%3Duk_gov_ccew_portlet_CharitySearchPortlet%26amp%3Bp_p_lifecycle%3D1%26amp%3Bp_p_state%3Dnormal%26amp%3Bp_p_mode%3Dview%26amp%3B_uk_gov_ccew_portlet_CharitySearchPortlet_cur%3D1%26amp%3B_uk_gov_ccew_portlet_CharitySearchPortlet_delta%3D20%26amp%3B_uk_gov_ccew_portlet_CharitySearchPortlet_keywords%3Dmermaids%26amp%3B_uk_gov_ccew_portlet_CharitySearchPortlet_orderByCol%3D%26amp%3B_uk_gov_ccew_portlet_CharitySearchPortlet_orderByType%3Dasc%26amp%3B_uk_gov_ccew_portlet_CharitySearchPortlet_priv_r_p_prevCol%3D%26amp%3B_uk_gov_ccew_portlet_CharitySearchPortlet_priv_r_p_useSession%3Dtrue%26amp%3B_uk_gov_ccew_portlet_CharitySearchPortlet_priv_r_p_mvcRenderCommandName%3D%252Fsearch-results&_uk_gov_ccew_onereg_charitydetails_web_portlet_CharityDetailsPortlet_priv_r_p_organisationNumber=5054976
as of 31st march 2019 they were carrying forward £415,160 !!!

Of course this could be seen as extremely financially prudent in that the wheels on the trans bus are about to fall off... This could keep them going a year and a half when all their doners finally flee.

Some of that was the hbomb stream, but theyve also received about £300,000 in private donations which is pretty staggering for a charity of that size. They've got five years of lottery funding coming as well, they look pretty secure for the next few years to me.

You don’t come across pro trans Cloudy.