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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

THE CODDLING OF THE AMERICAN MIND

150 replies

queenofknives · 27/09/2020 14:47

We are going to read Jonathan Haidt's book The Coddling of the American Mind and the discussion will start here on 17 October 2020. Everyone welcome!

Further books suggested for discussion are:

Cynical Theories, by James Lindsay and Helen Joyce
The Intellectual Life of the British Working Classes, by Jonathan Rose
On Liberty, by JS Mill
Why You Should Read the Classics, by Italo Calvino
The Madness of Crowds, by Douglas Murray

Further suggestions are also welcome. Looking forward to the chat!

OP posts:
YetAnotherSpartacus · 27/09/2020 14:51

I'm a bit surprised that so many British feminists are not on the MN readings lists. I'm thinking Rowbotham, Mitchell and so on.

I think that Mumsnetters would really like Pateman's The Sexual Contract. Written in circa 1988 it makes some very salient points about recognising sex (and not gender).

Original poster
queenofknives · 27/09/2020 15:01

This has sprung out of another thread where we've been looking mainly at woke ideology as it plays through various institutions. These are the books that people expressed an interest in reading, but definitely more can be added and of course people can be part of multiple book discussions.

You're more than welcome to join us if you fancy the book!

OP posts:
YetAnotherSpartacus · 27/09/2020 15:06

I did see that thread - but thought that it was here that you were asking for suggestions :)

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 27/09/2020 15:09

I'm up for this one. Will download the book.

Original poster
queenofknives · 27/09/2020 15:11

Either is fine! But there are more people on that thread discussing the books and ideas we want to look at, so you might get more responses there.

OP posts:
Original poster
queenofknives · 27/09/2020 15:12

I'm glad to have people to discuss it with Grumpy! It's been on my list for a while, so it's good to have a reason to just get on with it :)

OP posts:
BabyItsAWildWorld · 27/09/2020 15:18

I'm in.
I had actually downloaded the audio book last week, so am pleased to now be able to listen and discuss.

Siablue · 27/09/2020 15:28

I am reading this now. I would like to see some classic feminist books as future reading.

Original poster
queenofknives · 27/09/2020 15:36

Not sure what the best place is to make recommendations as I can't edit the OP to add them on there. But maybe you could add suggestions to the original Joe Rogan thread or make a new book club thread specifically for suggestions?

OP posts:
Original poster
queenofknives · 27/09/2020 15:38

Okay, done. www.mumsnet.com/Talk/feminist_book_club/4035322-Reading-suggestions?watched=1

Add your suggestions to the suggestion thread, then we can keep this thread clear for the Haidt discussion. Cheers Smile

OP posts:
TheRealMcKenna · 27/09/2020 16:26

Just for reference, here is the website with all the notes and figures from the book. It’s very useful if you’re ‘reading’ the audio version.

www.thecoddling.com/notes-references

EarlofEggMcMuffin · 27/09/2020 16:35

That looks interesting- may I join?
I'm off to see if I can download it or get the audio version.

Stripesgalore · 27/09/2020 17:22

Everyone is welcome to join. Smile

I am going to see if I can get it on Audible.

Harriedharriet · 27/09/2020 18:19

I am here and will read/follow. May not participate much but I am soaking all of this up like a sponge.....Grin

Cailleach1 · 27/09/2020 19:32

Bookmark

MalcolmTuckersBollockingface · 27/09/2020 19:58

I’m in. Thanks for setting this up.

BovaryX · 27/09/2020 20:38

I'm in and thank you so much for setting this up! That thread was so interesting and it's great that it generated a book club!

Mominatrix · 27/09/2020 21:07

Placemarking

Siablue · 28/09/2020 09:24

So far I have read the first 3 chapters. They discuss intersectionality and how a bizarre interpretation of it has been used to justify violence against people who for the flimsiest of reasons can be seen as oppressors. They are positive about intersectionality as an idea but critical of the points scoring version of it where people map their oppression in comparison to others.

How can we be aware of the differences between us? Take account of them in a fair way that doesn’t other people and still retain a focus on our common humanity. I think it is hard but we don’t want to throw the baby out with the bath water. We are feminists and we want to keep feminism (which is seen by some as a form of identity politics). We understand the need for groups like Southall Black Sisters.

There is a massive leap between recognising inequalities in society and setting up something to support people who are disadvantaged and going round beating people up who you think are oppressions. Perhaps there needs to be a focus on universal rights as well.

Anyway that is just my thoughts so far?

Mominatrix · 28/09/2020 11:53

Here is a link to the original Atlantic Magazine article. At the side of the article are the authors responses to some of the criticism to the article.

Original poster
queenofknives · 28/09/2020 13:53

Is it okay to hold off on the discussion until people have had a chance to read the book? I haven't even got my copy yet!

OP posts:
TheRealMcKenna · 28/09/2020 14:13

@queenofknives

Is it okay to hold off on the discussion until people have had a chance to read the book? I haven't even got my copy yet!
How about setting a date and then discussing one chapter at a time, a bit like TV threads?
Stripesgalore · 28/09/2020 14:15

The start date is 17th October.

TheRealMcKenna · 28/09/2020 14:23

@Stripesgalore

The start date is 17th October.
Oops, sorry - missed that!
Stripesgalore · 28/09/2020 14:24
Smile