Women’s Equality Party waking up to unpopularity of self-ID?

[thinkingaboutLangCleg]

I wrote off the Women’s Equality Party when I read their statement supporting self-ID in 2017: “We recognise that the binary words “woman” and “man” do not reflect the gender experience of everyone in our country and support the right of all to define their sex or gender or to reject gendered divisions as they choose..”

But now it seems they’re running a consultation on it.

This was in the Guardian on Thursday 17th September.
www.theguardian.com/society/2020/sep/17/womens-equality-party-runs-consultation-on-self-identification-for-trans-people

Does anyone know any more about it? I can't find anything on the WEP website about it. It seems an odd time to start a consultation, just before the government was due to announce a decision on changing the law.

I suppose it’s a step forward that they’re even considering self-ID might not appeal to most women.

That's their tweet of the guardian article which got the most responses. They seem to have a lot of trans people commenting and not a lot of women.

It feels to me like they're being brigaded, most of the TRAs commenting on her tweets don't seem to be WEP members and many not even in the U.K. it seems they're getting flak for daring to have a debate about this issue, even though Mandu Reid fell over herself to say that it wasn't a debate, but to inform WEP policy.

Men Explaining things to Women Party

*It's like the RSPB holding a consultation to work out what a 'bird' is

My cats would vote for the bandwidth of birds to be widened. They'd use their democratic vote to be included in the description of birds. They'd like bird sanctuaries to be 'inclusive' of all birds and to be welcomed onto one with all the 'other' type(s) of birds.

@Cailleach1

It's like the RSPB holding a consultation to work out what a 'bird' is

My cats would vote for the bandwidth of birds to be widened. They'd use their democratic vote to be included in the description of birds. They'd like bird sanctuaries to be 'inclusive' of all birds and to be welcomed onto one with all the 'other' type(s) of birds.

this...

I knew someone in Lewes who was very heavily involved with WEP some years ago. A good feminist. I've noted from facebuik she seems not to be anymore. I think by their idiotcy they have lost all the great women activists.

Aaagh, I spent ages looking up that info about
a) Heather Brunskell Evans (child-safeguarding hero, dismissed by the WEP as their spokeswoman on violence against women and children) and
b) GP Adrian Harrop, who received an award from a panel including the present WEP leader Mandu Reid.
www.rainbowhonours.com

Is it OK to say I wouldn't myself, as someone who opposes gender stereotyping especially of children, have given Dr Harrop an award? I'm trying not to get deleted this time.

I always try to try to keep the Mumsnet rules because I appreciate the very rare space this gives us to talk about women's rights.

It's like the RSPB holding a consultation to work out what a 'bird' is

...and letting the debate be dominated by cats.
Who identify as birds.
Suggesting that cats might eat the birds is literal violence.

At this point it's simply not worth trying to redeem them, they need to fade away into obscurity along with the LibDems.

There is a resistance in WEP in the form of a Women's Caucus- set up in the same vein as The Labour Women's Declaration.

The process is a stitch up as it is designed by @NatCen of Nancy Kelly (Stonewall Fame). However the consultation is not going as they would like it to go.

The Caucus tweets on @WepWomen, and are using #WEPfactcheck to fact check all the pro self id evidence being given to the members assembly

We are urging women to join to help us reclaim our party from the wokes. WEP also supports the Nordic Model.Its party structure needs improving but with the right women it could be a force for good.

The Caucus is building its website as a self ID/feminist resource. The blogs detail what is going on
www.wepsbr.com

There is a resistance in WEP in the form of a Women's Caucus- set up in the same vein as The Labour Women's Declaration.

Sad that there has to be a women’s caucus in the Women’s Equality Party, but I’m glad there is one.

www.wepsbr.com/
That’s a useful link, and very clear about women’s sex-based rights being human rights.

Interesting that the WEP has already debated self-ID, and found (surprise) it wasn’t popular:
In late 2018, a motion was brought to conference. This motion was pro sex self-ID. This motion was not passed, in a clear majority agreement for the motion to be 'referred back'.

Best of luck, CautionEscalator. We need a women’s party that centres women.

Kudos to the women in this resistance but what an irony that women need a women's caucus in an attempt to refocus the WEP on women's rights as opposed to men's.

So very sad.

I'd join if there were a less craven TWAW leader.

I've just read the Party conference motion on Equal Pay. It's unbelievably stupid.

It seems you have to pay 25 quid to log on to the conference to vote for a motion! Non members can vote for 30 quid.

Doing politics differently? Yeah ok.

TransWomens Equality Rights Party

OldCrony
Need to think about changing their name. Any ideas?
TWERPs for short

TransWomens Equality Rights Party - TWERPs for short

I just watched the second of their 'live testimonials'. Our side gave a much better showing. The beginning's a bit tedious because it's responses to questions from the first set, but it gets better. If the WEP decide after that to go down the TWAW route they're completely lost and not very bright.

I can't be doing with any party that only gives a tiny nod to something because they sense which way the wind is blowing. I'd like to see a party with the intelligence to grasp the significance of biological sex and see the emperor's new clothes for what they patently are. It's not exactly a high bar to hurdle. Traditionally, 100% of the population managed it.

It's gratifying to see such luminaries as Jane Clare Jones, Karen Ingalia Smith and Mumsnet's Rebecca Bull) being invited to speak here on this subject. But that is not enough.

In spite of the expertise brought in to this consultation, regrettably the party structure and process for the executive committee votes in popular people in the party who are clueless about the subject they are voted in to represent. Until the party learns how to use expert members properly they will continue to be mediocre amateurs.

Kristina Harrison being excellent again, in another WEP talk.

I just hope the right people are listening. But getting a platform at all is progress...

twitter.com/KJ_Harrison/status/1310598013316890626

I'm a member and I'm grateful to the sex based rights caucus for keeping on with this, and for developing the web site.

I was also worried about NatCen but I'm not sure it really is a stitch up. I haven't watched the evidence yet but the fact that they took evidence from many significant people who are v against self id suggests that the citizen's assembly (who I think call the experts) are approaching it properly, so have been selected well. That should bode well for the consultation questions that will be put out to members. But we will see.

On the other side, at least a couple of trans academic experts were asked to give evidence but declined.

I know it's a stupid situation, and it would be much better if women's orgs all agreed with us, but they don't. The fact this process is taking place is positive. I hope it ends with the result I want, but just as much I hope the process turns out to be genuine. We need models for how organisations can deal with this. Someone (joanna cherry maybe?) on any questions apparently suggested a citizens assembly to deal with the issue at the level of law, but orgs that are in a pickle over this could do with some models for how to get out of this impasse too.

I dont know what Mandu would do either if it came out the way she doesn't want. Maybe we'll find out.

[quote NecessaryScene1]Kristina Harrison being excellent again, in another WEP talk.

I just hope the right people are listening. But getting a platform at all is progress...

twitter.com/KJ_Harrison/status/1310598013316890626[/quote]
Yes, I just watched that - really good.