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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Top surgery funder for non binary person in local rag

77 replies

HDDD · 16/08/2020 12:24

First time I've seen a piece like this in the Manchester Evening News
www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/nonbinary-fundraiser-surgery-chest-salford-18757669

OP posts:
testing987654321 · 16/08/2020 14:45

I thought feminism was about women's rights to live their life without judgement

We are social animals, no-one can live their lives without judgement.

That a young woman believes that cutting off her breasts will help with a non-binary identity is a sign that our society is not one in which women feel confident or safe in their natural body.

The people pushing the idea that mutilating surgery is a good thing are criminal in my opinion.

OldCrone · 16/08/2020 15:01

I thought feminism was about women's rights to live their life without judgement, without feeling pressured to be any kind of way that society says they should be.

So it's worrying that this young woman says: “But I came to terms with being non-binary a few months ago when I realised I had to identify as something more clear to other people."

And now she feels that she has to alter her body to fit in with what she perceives to be required by society.

If she embraced feminism instead of genderwoo, she would be able to say 'I am who I am and my body doesn't need to change to fit anyone else's expectations'.

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 16/08/2020 15:02

@Beni1993

I thought feminism was about women's rights to live their life without judgement, without feeling pressured to be any kind of way that society says they should be. Guess I was mistaken and definitely not a feminist anymore
Feminism isn’t and never was about thinking anything any woman ever does is a good idea. How could it be?
Durgasarrow · 16/08/2020 15:19

Why do you need a double mastectomy to be non-binary? If you want to be consistent, shouldn't you hang on to one breast?

Marmite27 · 16/08/2020 15:25

Apparently she was born with a large chest Hmm

DianasLasso · 16/08/2020 15:31

@Marmite27

Apparently she was born with a large chest Hmm
I noticed that - they've wanted the op for 22 years according to the article. (And yet also only came to terms with being non-binary a few months back...)
Falleninwiththewrongcrowd · 16/08/2020 17:22

"Earlier this year, they began identifying as non-binary"
and
"I have identified as non-binary for as long as I can remember"

Amnesia?

fatblackcatspaw · 16/08/2020 19:36

@Beni1993

I thought feminism was about women's rights to live their life without judgement, without feeling pressured to be any kind of way that society says they should be. Guess I was mistaken and definitely not a feminist anymore
you are thinking of liberal feminism the prostitution is a liberating career choice feminism... Emma Watson Feminism... are there any Lib Fems here?
SerenityNowwwww · 16/08/2020 19:43

If you are non binary why exactly can’t you have boobs?

DidoLamenting · 16/08/2020 19:52

@OldCrone

I thought feminism was about women's rights to live their life without judgement, without feeling pressured to be any kind of way that society says they should be.

So it's worrying that this young woman says: “But I came to terms with being non-binary a few months ago when I realised I had to identify as something more clear to other people."

And now she feels that she has to alter her body to fit in with what she perceives to be required by society.

If she embraced feminism instead of genderwoo, she would be able to say 'I am who I am and my body doesn't need to change to fit anyone else's expectations'.

Many people (most?) don't embrace feminism but never experience anything like this. I think their confusion about themselves is very deep.

But I came to terms with being non-binary a few months ago when I realised I had to identify as something more clear to other people

I have no idea what they mean by having to identify as something more clear to other people.

SerenityNowwwww · 16/08/2020 19:56

People just are. No need to ‘identify’ or ‘see myself as’. You just are. If you think you can be only happier in life by making unnecessary cosmetic modifications to your body then you need to really think about who you are inside.

FemaleAndLearning · 16/08/2020 20:20

Serenitynowww
That's what I dont understand about non-binary. Why can't you be a non binary with breasts why do you have to look like a man?
It's the same as gender neutral clothes that are trousers.
I think saying you are non-binary is just so bizarre. You don't identify with being male or female, but you ARE male or female!

OldCrone · 16/08/2020 20:34

I think saying you are non-binary is just so bizarre. You don't identify with being male or female, but you ARE male or female!

I keep hoping that a believer in non-binary will explain what it's about. I read some of the replies to this tweet in the hope that someone would explain it, having said that the quoted tweet from LGB Alliance was wrong about what it was.

twitter.com/hotcistakes/status/1277767840808996865

It's just lots of people saying 'it doesn't mean that', with nobody explaining what it is. I've asked people on threads on here what it is a few times as well, and none of them have been willing/able to explain what it is either.

DuDuDuLangaLangaBingBong · 16/08/2020 20:36

There are thousands of top surgery crowd funders online. Wonder why MEN journalist Adam Maidment decided to make a story out of this particular one?

‘Young female human hates her breasts’ Is hardly newsworthy in 2020.

Delphinium20 · 16/08/2020 20:43

I can't get over the fact that she is butchering her body. I've known two women who had breast reduction surgery to ease back pain- and they felt so much better afterwards. But this is not the same thing. I can't see that she will feel better afterwards or more like herself. Also, what if at age 35, she decides she wants to have a child? Not everyone breastfeeds, but you've just purposefully removed that option. We all have regrets for things we did at 22. This could be a biggie.

Delphinium20 · 16/08/2020 20:44

@GoshHashana

fellow surgeon Dr. Giancarlo McEvenue (more on him anon) wearing a mask and a Santa Claus hat holds up two buckets labelled “Breast tissue,” accompanied by a Dr McLean post: “For all you good boys, Dr McEvenue is not bringing gifts, he’s taking them away!”

Fucking hell...

So much for "do no harm"
Deliriumoftheendless · 16/08/2020 21:43

@OldCrone

I think saying you are non-binary is just so bizarre. You don't identify with being male or female, but you ARE male or female!

I keep hoping that a believer in non-binary will explain what it's about. I read some of the replies to this tweet in the hope that someone would explain it, having said that the quoted tweet from LGB Alliance was wrong about what it was.

twitter.com/hotcistakes/status/1277767840808996865

It's just lots of people saying 'it doesn't mean that', with nobody explaining what it is. I've asked people on threads on here what it is a few times as well, and none of them have been willing/able to explain what it is either.

I’m so sorry I hit report instead of quote on this post.
Deliriumoftheendless · 16/08/2020 21:44

How do I in report?

Deliriumoftheendless · 16/08/2020 21:44

UN report.

I need to stop posting with these fingers.

wellbehavedwomen · 16/08/2020 22:05

@Beni1993

I thought feminism was about women's rights to live their life without judgement, without feeling pressured to be any kind of way that society says they should be. Guess I was mistaken and definitely not a feminist anymore
What can be more evidence someone is "feeling pressured to be any kind of way that society says they should be" than that person thinking, "I can't bear the arbitrary societal expectations indiscriminately placed upon all women... so I'll have my breasts excised, and look less like a woman, and the societal expectations will change..."

That's not working for the liberation of women - which is feminism. That's conceding that unbearably rigid gender roles are best countered not by women refusing to accept them, but by extreme plastic surgery being made available so some can evade being seen as women at all. That's not really a solution, is it?

I also note that you're defining this person as a woman. That's transphobic, by the present definitions. This person is not and never was a woman, if you buy the belief system. I don't, so I'm with you - but transmen and non-binary natal women tend not to want to be grouped as women. That's the point, no?

I really hope this person is happy afterwards, and it works out for them, whatever choices they make. We all have to do whatever we can to try to be happy in life, and this hurts nobody else, so I strongly hope it's the intended solution to the described feelings. But it makes me really fucking sad, that this is where we are as a society, and this is what we're doing to people.

TheKarenWhoKnocks · 16/08/2020 22:26

Adam Maidment is MEN's LGBTQ+ reporter so this article is on topic for him, even though it couldn't be considered news. He ran a piece a couple of days ago about the transphobic behaviour of Manchester door staff at a venue who refused entry to this woman, citing reasons to do with dress code.

Top surgery funder for non binary person in local rag
TheKarenWhoKnocks · 16/08/2020 22:30

Head shot from the article of the woman who didn't meet the dress code:

Top surgery funder for non binary person in local rag
littlbrowndog · 16/08/2020 22:34

Wow 😮

PotholeParadise · 16/08/2020 22:35

Manchester Evening News is very, er, supportive, isn't it? If they can print a story about someone in swaetpants getting turned away from a very swish restaurant as transphobia, then this is an easy story.

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/spinningfields-bar-accused-transphobia-after-18761963