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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

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Original poster

Laverne Cox on Brene Brown's podcast

42 replies

Lottapianos · 13/08/2020 10:38

Oh lord, it was bad. You may say I only have myself to blame, and you would be right, and I knew the episode would annoy me, but I went in anyway!

Jesus, the fawning. I do like Brene Brown a lot, but she is a terrible fawner and boy did she turn it up to 11 with Laverne! So proud to refer to Laverne as 'my friend', praising Laverne's 'wonderful intellect' , basically on her knees in awe the whole way through

There was lots of tearful listing of names of transwomen who have been murdered - fine, those are sickening crimes and its perfectly legitimate to mention them . JK Rowling got mentioned a couple of times with a sigh and you could hear the eye roll- none of the content of what Rowling actually wrote or tweeted of course, just 'the JK Rowling issue' like shes the antichrist or something

Then the issue of women wanting to keep toilets etc as single sex spaces. Brene just DOESN'T GET IT and TWAW and she 'identifies as a woman' (no Brene, you just ARE a woman) and women need to remember that 'fear is not real, it's just a feeling'. Nice 🙄 then Laverne adds that 'ciswomen' need to carry out some 'self reflection' about why we're so het up about TW popping into women's toilets for a little old wee or whatever. Like, how does it affect us, really? And 'where is the love?'
we're all supposed to be rightly horrified by violence against transwomen, but heaven forbid that we acknowledge the violence and threats faced by women every single day

So yeah, it was profound. Shame on Brene Brown for enabling this shit - shes a bright, well educated women who is pretending to be stupid. Cox came across as arrogant and entitled, disguised with fake-bewildered, breathy delivery, and having zero empathy or understanding for women, and zero interest in engaging with women's very real concerns. And not enormously stable emotionally

I listened so you dont have to just felt the need to get it off my chest!

OP posts:

IheartJKR · 14/08/2020 08:04

‘Fear is a feeling’.

Fear is what keeps us alive as women. That fear is exactly what we are required to nurture and listen to...it protects us. It is shameful that a woman with a social work background would minimise a women’s instincts.

KarenFitzkaren · 14/08/2020 08:23

Fear is a feeling, and feelings aren't real, but when a man says I feel like a woman, that's completely real and "valid"? Okay... Not forgetting that males who feel they are women also claim to feel too afraid to use the men's loos - I guess that fear isn't real either?

For sure. Which boils down to the fact that people's feelings matter, apart from the women who won't toe the line. Their feelings don't matter at all and they should put up and shut up.

LockdownLump · 14/08/2020 08:24

Fear is a feeling is it? So you can 'get over' a feeling?

So if a male has a 'feeling' that he was born in the wrong body and has a 'feeling' that he should be a female, then surely they can sort it out and get over it!

lionheart · 14/08/2020 11:18

You took one for the team there OP.

Original poster

Lottapianos · 14/08/2020 11:54

'You took one for the team there OP'

maybe my blood pressure is low and this was my body's way of trying to get me to send it higher?

I do think it's important to stay aware of how crazy it's getting out there, but only in manageable doses and always trying to prioritise your mental health. The level of misogyny and dismissal of women's feelings and experiences is really gruelling

OP posts:

lionheart · 14/08/2020 12:25

Reading your summary was bad enough.

SetYourselfOnFire · 14/08/2020 21:47

women need to remember that 'fear is not real, it's just a feeling'. Nice ^and women need to remember that 'fear is not real, it's just a feeling'. Nice 🙄 then Laverne adds that 'ciswomen' need to carry out some 'self reflection' about why we're so het up about TW popping into women's toilets for a little old wee or whatever. Like, how does it affect us, really? And 'where is the love?'^

Love isn't real, it's just a feeling. Gender identity isn't real, it's just a feeling. Why do your feelings matter Laverne, and ours don't? Hmmmm.

^When they say feelings aren't real, what they mean is 'men's feelings are real and important but women are only allowed feelings when it doesn't inconvenience anyone else.'^

This. They care more about the feelings of a gangster who burned a 13 year old black girl to death in a racial hate crime after raping her, than us. (Laverne only removed support after learning it was ALSO a racist attack.)

SocialMedea · 20/08/2020 11:37

You know what else I'm getting fucking sick of? Women with a public profile, like Brene, who bang on ENDLESSLY about their kids and / or their menopause (i.e. their experiences of female biology), joining in with the 'sex is not real' or 'sex is a spectrum' bandwagon for woke points? You cant have it both ways, you FUCKING idiots! Stop pretending to be so bloody stupid and stop throwing other women under the bus, and cherry picking which bits of womanhood are real or not. Just get a grip on reality and show some respect for yourselves and for other women. How dare you

Very good post Lotta.

PurpleHatWarrior · 03/03/2021 19:08

I tossed her books after this. It was gross to hear her shill for pillows (or was it a sheet set?) and then pretty much go ga ga over a celebrity. We need reality based people in her field, done with the woo woo types.

jules0607 · 03/03/2021 19:47

Not ‘cis’ so no reflection required.XX

PurpleHatWarrior · 03/03/2021 20:18

Buzzinwithbez · 03/03/2021 21:04

I wonder if brene has changed her tune since her early books? While they were about vulnerability, they were heavily about boundaries and only being vulnerable with the right, trusted people. I found some of her discussion on this very helpful for my young daughter to give her some tangeable guidelines on how not to be a pushover.
I've always felt Brene was one of the more grounded self help type people.

It's very disappointing to hear about this interview. We should now ignore our boundaries and instincts? The ones many of us have been socialized to overrule and have had to work hard to put back in place.

I've been in a very scary situation when a drunk man came into a mixed sex loo when I was on my own in there. The fear was very much real and justified. Of course fear is more than just a feeling!

PurpleHatWarrior · 03/03/2021 21:43

Maybe she was just starstruck?

Sorry that happened to you in the loo - your situation is a reality for many of is these days.

Have you shared it with noconflicttheysaid.org yet?

Buzzinwithbez · 03/03/2021 22:09

No I haven't, I'll check the website out.

Buzzinwithbez · 03/03/2021 22:13

Oh dear...

PurpleHatWarrior · 03/03/2021 23:30

Sorry to see that it is still down. Crazy that women can’t have a website to discuss and collect their feelings anymore. She has her email address there though.

Writersblock2 · 03/03/2021 23:42

This is very depressing. I have gained much from Brene’s books at a time I was really searching for something to help me. They really struck a chord. I’m not saying they’re perfect, but there is a lot of good there. But this is really frustrating. I’m not going to buy any more of her work if this is indicative of her stance.

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