New rugby thread

[DianasLasso]

To discuss this:
www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/53667683

Last thread was pulled, presumably for "misgendering", so be careful with pronouns and so forth, because it's worth discussing.

There's now a wealth of scientific evidence (e.g. recent study by Karolinska institute) to show that transwomen retain enough advantage over natal women to have an unfair competitive edge, and in the case of rugby, to pose a significantly raised risk of injuring other players (best case scenario was about 20 to 30% increased risk according to the recent RFU report.

Yet the BBC keeps running these sob story articles, despite the science being quite clear that it is both unsafe and unfair towards women.

It was pointed out that these articles often feature very slightly built trans-women (one assumes to garner sympathy). But even so, people who've been through male puberty but then transition remain significantly stronger than women even if, compared to a men's rugby team, they look skinny and slight.

Someone on the last thread made this comment a propos of slimly built men.

Purely anecdotal, but my 2 youngest brothers are like rakes and only a tiny bit taller than me. Both still as strong as an Ox though, because of male puberty. I have no doubt they'd destroy me in a physical game of anything. Looking at them, you'd think they weigh about 8 stone wringing wet, but they're heavy.

My sport used to be climbing. I've known several husband-wife climbing partnerships where the woman was by far the better technical climber, but the man climbed harder just because he was stronger. One pair in particular stick in my memory, where, having watched the woman lead an overhanging E3 on limestone, I discovered she couldn't do a single pull-up of her own body weight. He, on the other hand, could do pull ups (from a finger edge, not a bar) until he gave up from sheer boredom. He was a very slightly built bloke, too, and about an inch shorter than her.

On the other thread, I pointed out how it was notable how there was no perspective from anyone McKenzie plays against or has to share changing rooms with.

Hannah Mouncey was finally asked to leave the Australian women’s handball team because Mouncey’s team mates no longer wanted to share showers with Mouncey. Make of that what you will.

I have been to a few tech conferences but nobody has ever approached me to play rugby

What am I doing wrong?

Zana next time, have more penis.

I started to read that Mackenzie quote and thought it was a woman talking who was no longer able to play the game despite loving it because having transwomen playing as part of the teams was just making it too dangerous to continue.

Oh the irony! Can’t believe that Mackenzie thinks it is perfectly fine to make it so dangerous for non-transwomen to play with them, without any regard for the health and safety implications though!

being granted access to a woman’s rugby team is hardly up there in the ranks of things one might want to do to be recognised and accepted as a “woman”.

I think this is generally called having your cake and eating it too.

Pretty much everyone else in the world accepts that making life-changing decisions means giving up some things in order to have other things. Have children - goodbye to all-nighters. Get married - goodbye to playing the field. Move house - goodbye favourite cafe.

But not this segment of the population. And they don’t even have to give up their sport, just admit for the sake of fairness, there are teams they shouldn’t be on. It’s almost like the only thing they care about is themselves.

Trans athletes have also expressed concern, and activists like McKenzie have described it as "a gut punch

Try taking one from someone with almost twice your upper body strength

Does anyone have the link to the leaked Rugby findings on body strength ? It might be useful to have it here

The BBC article is seriously one-sided. And funny how the only scientists saying transwomen don't have an advantage are the trans scientists who want to play in women's sports.