Health service workers and sex specific services.

[Angryresister]

I am not in Uk but would like examples of current practice.
I went for a regular mammogram recently, which has always been a good service, with female radiographers. They always take a good look , ask about inverted nipple and rashes and so on. This time it was a very different experience. First it was a male, without a female present, and I commented that for a relatively intimate procedure, I was not comfortable. He told me it was about Equal opportunities ( for whom?) I told him it was not personal but there were other women who would also be uncomfortable or worse. However I carried on. He then proceeded to push and shove me roughly into the machine without asking me about anything. I intend to take this further but would be interested in how much these days you can request same sex care eg for smears and so on in the Uk. I understand that in emergencies I would be grateful for all medical staff, and know that for other xrays I would have no problem. And that health services are stretched.

OP that's absolutely horrible, I'm so sorry. Men are not entitled to "equal opportunities" to handle the breasts of vulnerable women - I'm glad you are taking this further.

As far as your question, my understanding is that in theory and in law we have the right to same sex care - but in practice males are lobbying hard to take that right away, and women who request same sex care have been publically labelled transphobes. I'm sure someone will be along shortly who can give you details and citations, I really just replied to offer you commiserations. That's awful.

I also don't have any expertise in this but I just wanted to say that I would not be comfortable with a male doing a mammogram or a smear test. It's never happened to me but if it did I would flatly refuse. I shouldn't have to disclose my history of sexual assault but if it came to it I would. You're not wrong for feeling like you do and you shouldn't have to explain yourself.

Which country are in?

Sorry, which country are you in?

equal opportunities my arse.....can I ask what country you are in?

Spain. But here there is the usual push back on women’s rights also. In principal I can accept that male staff are employed and would have no problem with eg X Ray for leg. But this seemed remarkably insensitive, especially the equal opps statement. Just trying to find the best way of exploring this. Filling in the complaint forms does not work.

Wow - I'm in Ireland, and went for a mammogram recently, and it was women at every point (which I am very grateful for). My GP assured me that this would be the case.

I wouldn't have wanted a man performing the exams, or the mammogram - in fact I switched GPs for this reason (my older male GP was fine, but I just didn't want him giving me a breast exam).

That's pretty shocking, OP.

To me what springs to mind is that your consent was not freely given. It was coerced when the practitioner said "equal opportunities". There are power imbalances inherent in the relationship (male - female and practitioner - patient) which make gaining informed and freely given consent especially important.

There's an NHS page on consent I will try and find.

I can and do request female practitioners for smear tests (UK) but of course the NHS records gender identity instead of sex so it is not impossible a male bodied practitioner would turn up.

From NHS website

"Defining consent
For consent to be valid, it must be voluntary and informed, and the person consenting must have the capacity to make the decision.

The meaning of these terms are:

voluntary – the decision to either consent or not to consent to treatment must be made by the person, and must not be influenced by pressure from medical staff, friends or family
informed – the person must be given all of the information about what the treatment involves, including the benefits and risks, whether there are reasonable alternative treatments, and what will happen if treatment does not go ahead
capacity – the person must be capable of giving consent, which means they understand the information given to them and can use it to make an informed decision"

Yes I could have walked out. I chose not to do so. The reality was so different from previous occasions....

I think the NHS has used the single-sex exemption to train only women for mammograms?
Mine was very hands on, the (female) professional directed me to push myself into position, but I think she also “handled” my boobs and back.

That's awful OP. It's currently the case here that the NHS uses the Genuine Occupational Requirements of the Equality Act to only employ women as mammographers but I think this may be done on a Trust by Trust basis and I'm not sure there's anything to stop a Trust deciding they'd like to employ men.

Interestingly, the Society of Radiographers has been pushing for many years to have this overturned and to allow men to carry out mammograms on the grounds that a) there's a shortage of radiographers and b) equality/men's rights.www.sor.org/about-radiography/media-centre/press-releases/radiographers-call-breast-screening-be-carried-out-men-well-women
I think their argument goes that "you'd see a male consultant gynaecologist or breast surgeon if you had a suspicious lump, they're all medical professionals, so what's your problem?" or something. Personally, I would always prefer to have a woman carrying out intimate procedures like a smear test or a mammogram.

Sorry, I didn't do link properly www.sor.org/about-radiography/media-centre/press-releases/radiographers-call-breast-screening-be-carried-out-men-well-women

I thought the having a female colleague present when a male HCP was doing an intimate procedure was also to protect the male HCP from false accusations. I'm surprised he was comfortable doing a procedure like that alone.

Interesting on that link that there are no stats about how women feel about this. Surely the first thing you should do is survey women to understand how many of them would rather have a female doing this procedure?

Also interesting that mammograms are the only procedure that are female-only. I didn't know that.

@WhereAreWeNow

That's awful OP. It's currently the case here that the NHS uses the Genuine Occupational Requirements of the Equality Act to only employ women as mammographers but I think this may be done on a Trust by Trust basis and I'm not sure there's anything to stop a Trust deciding they'd like to employ men.

Interestingly, the Society of Radiographers has been pushing for many years to have this overturned and to allow men to carry out mammograms on the grounds that a) there's a shortage of radiographers and b) equality/men's rights.www.sor.org/about-radiography/media-centre/press-releases/radiographers-call-breast-screening-be-carried-out-men-well-women
I think their argument goes that "you'd see a male consultant gynaecologist or breast surgeon if you had a suspicious lump, they're all medical professionals, so what's your problem?" or something. Personally, I would always prefer to have a woman carrying out intimate procedures like a smear test or a mammogram.

Everything being equal and given a choice I wonder how many women would choose another woman for anything about their sexual health.

No way I would I be happy with that.

I have been pushed and pulled around by a female mammographer who did not seem able to explain anything adequately and that was bad enough.

In the clinic, it was female staff with a male radiographer, accompanied by the female mammographer for the ultrasound & examination.

@twoHopes

Interesting on that link that there are no stats about how women feel about this. Surely the first thing you should do is survey women to understand how many of them would rather have a female doing this procedure?

Also interesting that mammograms are the only procedure that are female-only. I didn't know that.

I completely agree. You would think the starting point would be "What impact will this have on service users? Will it stop them coming forward for an important public screening programme? Will it create undue stress and anxiety for them?".

This is why I don't go for smears or mammograms.

rosie please go. I have always found them moments of female solidarity. You can make appointments and refuse treatment at any time if you are uncomfortable. You don’t have to give reasons.

It is really interesting and reassuring that mammograms are done by women. I hope that doesn't change.

I really wish that all gynaecologists, midwives and obstetricians were women too. It would be great if they were all female only jobs especially for the large numbers of women who have suffered male violence but also for others due to cultural or religious beliefs.

Really how is it that the rights of healthcare professionals to be able to impose themselves on women supersede the rights of the people for whom they are caring to feel safe and have access to the services they need? There are enough women who would self exclude from smears and mammograms after one experience of finding a male healthcare provider. Previous trauma can mean finding conflict scary and declining a procedure on the basis of feeling uncomfortable with the hp would be too much for some. It could seem easier to avoid being in that situation entirely.

Whatever happened to putting the needs of health service users as the priority?

The reason given for a shortage of women in obstetrics is that it's unsociable working, particularly hard to organise family life. I'd say that's an excellent example of the need to improve equal opportunities so that women can choose obstetrics without jeopardising their family responsibilities.