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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Gendered Intelligence

38 replies

PetraDelphiki · 08/06/2020 19:04

So we had an email today telling us about the new RSE curriculum etc. I have asked the school who will be giving talks etc on transgender issues and it’s Gendered Intelligence (which I thought it would be)
I need to reply to express my concerns about GI:

Misrepresenting the equality act
Telling the girls they can change sex (girls school)
Pushing secrecy/safeguarding
Pushing the gingerbread person and make/female brains idea

I’ll do some digging on their website but any help would be much appreciated

OP posts:
OhHolyJesus · 08/06/2020 19:07

I'll have a dig about x

PetraDelphiki · 08/06/2020 19:17

Thank you

My first point is going to be picking holes in their BAEB thing (gillick competency etc)

Second will be about this
genderedintelligence.co.uk/projects/kip/work

“ Work life

You may choose to start a new job in your self-identified gender or to transition at a current workplace. The Equality Act 2010 protects anyone who intends to undergo, is undergoing and has in the past undergone gender reassignment. There is no requirement for you to have undergone any hormones or surgery for you to be treated in your self-identified gender.

Good practice at your workplace would mean to:

Wear the uniform / workwear attributed to your self-identified gender

Use the toilets and changing room of your self-identified gender (including gender neutral toilets)

Have the correct name used at work and on any name badges etc. (You may only be able to have your legal name on your payslips or any formal documents)

Your employer has a legal obligation not to share a disclosure of trans status or different legal name with other colleagues if you do not wish them to.”

Pretty sure that this is outright wrong - the protected characteristic is actual gender reassignment and the comparator is the sex you are “leaving” not the one you are “joining”...can anyone point me at the correct information about this?

Any more thoughts gratefully received!

OP posts:
Deltoids1 · 08/06/2020 19:30

OP are you a parent or a staff member? As a parent of high school age girls I'm awaiting to see if school will communicate with us about the new RSE requirements.

PetraDelphiki · 08/06/2020 19:32

Parent...I know I’m not going to stop them bringing GI in but I want the school to know that GI will (most likely)be misrepresenting the law, pushing male/female brains, promoting Binding/hormones etc and are not necessarily appropriate people to be doing this training.

OP posts:
OhHolyJesus · 08/06/2020 19:33

The Equality Act 2010 protects anyone who intends to undergo, is undergoing and has in the past undergone gender reassignment.

This is the language of the EA but the exemption is key. You can dig out the language but I think is is something about being fake and reasonable.

Anyway here is the SSA red flags doc to check against

safeschoolsallianceuk.files.wordpress.com/2019/10/redflagsa4.pdf

I did look at gendered intelligence a while ago as I think they have advised or been involved in various different toolkits but I need to go back and check I'm not getting mixed up.

Have a search for them on MN as there could be some stuff you could easily use.

OhHolyJesus · 08/06/2020 19:34
  • fair and reasonable (although being fake could also apply Hmm)
truthisarevolutionaryact · 08/06/2020 19:38

Safeguarding is the issue to push. Do they attempt to breach safeguarding by promoting parental alienation? Persuading children below the age of consent that drugs and surgery are the way to go to resolve unhappiness with puberty. The old trope that children can be born in the wrong body, advocating that adults keep confidences in defiance of safeguarding protocols. etc etc...

truthisarevolutionaryact · 08/06/2020 19:42

Also ask what due diligence the school have undertaken? What are the qualifications of any presenters seeking to influence children's social, sexual and psychological development? Do they have safeguarding qualifications? Does the organisation / the presenters have any history of making threats of violence against women? Advocating for extreme porn? Have the school made these checks?

PetraDelphiki · 08/06/2020 20:11

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FlubberWorm · 08/06/2020 20:23

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request

FlubberWorm · 08/06/2020 20:26

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request

aliasundercover · 08/06/2020 20:32

Somebody is after screenshots.

PetraDelphiki · 08/06/2020 21:08

I’m very happy for the current advice of watchful waiting to be followed - I don’t want Lobby groups coming in and pushing early medical intervention on under 16s. I don’t want binders being encouraged. I don’t want safeguarding to be ignored. We don’t consider under 18s capable of making decisions about tattoos - we should not be encouraging lobby groups to push for them to be able to decide about a lifetime of drugs, surgery, infertility and the (still long term unknown) side effects of not going through puberty and the drugs involved.

Going back to the post I had deleted (sorry was outing) any evidence of any places GI would fall down on due diligence will be gratefully received...happy to take it by PM if you rather. I will have a good look too but multiple heads are better than one.

OP posts:
ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 08/06/2020 22:05

You may be able to find something in here:

www.transgendertrend.com/tag/gendered-intelligence/

PetraDelphiki · 08/06/2020 22:51

First draft - possibly a bit wordy?

Thank you for confirming who will be providing training on gender identity. I have a few further questions about this and the other contents of the RSE policy.

By what process was Gendered Intelligence chosen to provide this content? What scientific, legal, medical, educational or other qualifications does the planned speaker have that makes them competent to Influence the girls’ social, psychological and sexual development ?
By what process do you guarantee that their training and guidance meet the school's own safeguarding policy, particularly with respect to guarantees that information about trans feelings will be kept secret. I am aware that one of the main tenets of good safeguarding practice is to never promise to keep things secret. Sadly I am also aware that many groups such as GI suggest that this should be an exception, causing parental alienation, prompting unhealthy dependence between the child and their adult “secret keeper”, and removing any opportunity for safeguarding leads to work effectively.
• What measures are taken to ensure that the teaching of gender identity in RSE or PSHE does not conflict with the rights of those with the protected characteristics of sex and sexual orientation? How will you ensure that the girls are correctly advised of their rights to single sex (not gender) spaces under the equality act 2010?
• What measures are taken to ensure that the teaching of gender identity does not reinforce harmful gender stereotypes or otherwise suggest that boys and girls have innate personality differences? How will you ensure that the girls are not given any indication that a liking for STEM, or choosing to wear trousers, makes them more “boy like”?
• What measures are taken to ensure that the teaching of gender identity does not conflict with factual, scientific teaching of reproductive biology and anatomy? How will you ensure that any discussion of medical/surgical intervention covers the many long term health implications of this - not least of which is infertility.

Considering the rest of the RSE policy and curriculum:
• What measures are taken to ensure that pupils are aware that sexual violence (such as is routinely displayed in pornography or otherwise normalised as ‘fetish’) is not part of a healthy sexual relationship?

  • what measures are taken to ensure that the girls are aware of their right to refuse to consent to sexual activity in all cases regardless of the sex or gender identity of their partners? In particular the right of any lesbian students to refuse sex with a trans identified male (ie a female presenting person with a penis)

Yours etc

OP posts:
PetraDelphiki · 08/06/2020 22:52

Gah I lost the breaks between paragraphs! Sorry!

OP posts:
OneEpisode · 08/06/2020 23:16

Hi Petra, sounds like this is an all girl school? I might focus on why this particular organisation, a campaigning organisation, which is writing to Liz T to object to emerging gov policy, and has only recently acquired charitable status, has been chosen to provide this particular educational strand, especially if it is general sex ed.
I might not include the last section in a general comms.

teawamutu · 09/06/2020 08:16

That is a very good letter.

PetraDelphiki · 09/06/2020 08:37

Yes all girls...

OP posts:
PetraDelphiki · 09/06/2020 08:58

How about a second paragraph:

Are you aware that GI are currently campaigning against emerging government policy designed to protect under 18’s from making medically unnecessary irreversible bodily changes? Against policy designed to protect single sex spaces and opportunities?

You think remove the whole section about Porn/consent?

Also contemplating whether to add a link to this www.transgendertrend.com/gendered-intelligence-training-teachers-kiss-my-genders/ asan example of poor understanding of safeguarding/encouraging parental alienation ....or is that too much?

OP posts:
ThinEndoftheWedge · 09/06/2020 09:12

Against policy designed to protect single sex spaces and opportunities? - specifically designed for the safety, dignity, privacy and equity of opportunity for girls - which are founding principles of girls only schools.

Deltoids1 · 09/06/2020 09:13

I emailed my school last night to finding out what their RSE curriculum will be and if there will be external trainers. Thanks for the timely reminder.

ScrimpshawTheSecond · 09/06/2020 09:24

It's an excellent letter, Petra. Generally, if in doubt I would err on the side of less information. Ask simple, clear questions, that works really well. It gives the reader space to really consider the question. Ideally, you will prompt the reader to do their own research and it's less likely to provoke a defensive response or overwhelm them with detail.

It's one of the things I find a bit difficult about the whole gender debate, there's so flaming MUCH to talk about, because we've not been allowed to discuss ANY of it, that 1. It's hard to know where to start and 2. It's hard to know where to stop!

Where did I read something about not trying to make more than three points in a letter like this, or did I just imagine it ... might be an idea, anyway. Personally I'd probably choose the three things that concern me the most and focus on them.

I suppose maybe a meeting with someone at the school might be a good next step? Then you could bring along more evidence to show them, if need be. Hopefully you'll have prompted them to ask some questions, too. Would it be worth stating clearly what you'd like? I'm not sure - but maybe worth even considering what your 'good outcome' would be and how you might get there - assurances that sexism will not be tolerated, that parental alienation will not be supported, etc.

Good luck.

PetraDelphiki · 09/06/2020 10:25

Just popping out will post draft 2 for comments later - thanks for all the suggestions.

I think the outcome that I want is to be assured that the girls will not be misinformed about their rights under the law to single sex spaces, that they will clearly understand the difference between gender identity and sex (and that sex is immutable and determined at conception not randomly assigned at birth), and that they will not be brainwashed into believing gender stereotypes which are actually more enforced by the trans rhetoric that removed.

I'd quite like to ensure that the school promotes the same level of mental health care and support for gender questioning teens that they would for self harming or anorexics, rather than the GI policy of immediate acceptance and agreement...

Not quite sure how to phrase that but will ponder!

OP posts:
AlwaysTawnyOwl · 09/06/2020 14:52

This is an interesting experience of Gendered intelligence 'training' at a Russell Group University:-

"The content was as I expected: unscientific, fact-negligent, misrepresentative nonsense. The seemingly innocuous “non-binary” but wholly male presenting trainer, informing us that “they” decided to present masculine today to appear more “authoritative”, thus reinforcing regressive and demeaning gender stereotypes."

From:-

anglicanmainstream.org/standing-up-to-the-transcult-bullies/

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