MP receives abusive emails (from men) for taking mat leave

[Clymene]

Just saw this on the BBC:

MP Siobhan Baillie has received abusive messages from constituents for taking time off to care for her baby.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-52848963

So many men feel that women have no part to play in public life which should be very much structured around men and that women's needs which are different from men's should not be considered or downplayed.

Where does it say the comments were from men? It said "constituents".

Yeh but no but....
"Oh bugger" (as OP hurries off to see if they can find proof.)

It does indeed Dido. But in my experience, when journalists talk about people as a group, they tend to mean men. I also think it's fairly unlikely that women would complain about a woman taking a mere 4 weeks off after giving birth.

I'm making an assumption based on the evidence provided.

Childrenofthestones whether the "individuals" who sent the emails were men or were women so entrenched in patriarchy that they'd believe women shouldn't take maternity leave, it's bloody unacceptable that an MP is receiving emails attacking her for taking a measly four weeks maternity leave.

That's barely long enough to physically recover from an average birth (yes, the occasional woman feels fine and is back at work after no time, but far more need several weeks just for the physical recovery and concurrently to establish breastfeeding).

And obviously I was being deliberately provocative.

The BBC quote and one in the Daily Mail vary. BBC:
"Sadly, as an office, we have received an number of abusive emails, calls and social media posts from constituents in regards to Siobhan's decision to take maternity leave following the birth of her daughter last week."
Daily Mail:
'Sadly, Siobhan has received several such emails along these lines - the vast majority from men - who seem to think the 2010 Equality Act does not apply to a woman because she is an MP.'

It could be (for one, the other or both) poor note taking, deliberate editing of a quote (which seems dodgy) or separate interviews. I did initially think the Mail might have not being presenting what they reported as a direct quote but they do seem to only use single quotation marks.

I also think it's fairly unlikely that women would complain about a woman taking a mere 4 weeks off after giving birth

Oh ha ha - because women never complain about other women taking maternity leave- yeah right.

And obviously I was being deliberately provocative

No you were making it up to suit your own agenda.

It is a supposition that all the complaints were from men in the absence of a report that chose to capture that information. And I'd hazard a fair supposition at that.

because women never complain about other women taking maternity leave

I've lived quite a sheltered life so I'm sure there's worse out there but the most horrible abuse I've (indirectly) experienced relating to maternity leave was a new hire who thought it would be a good idea to, in her first week, refer to her manager as a "lazy c*" because she took the most maternity leave available to her (12 months, 9 at full salary).

I've never had children but I have had surgical recovery and sleep deprivation separately, the two together seem almost unthinkably challenging.

And obviously I was being deliberately provocative

No you were making it up to suit your own agenda.

I agree, attributing negative attributes to men on FWR isn't terribly provocative.

No, I was making a supposition. Which appears was correct

And obviously I was being deliberately provocative.

No, I was making a supposition. Which appears was correct

Your supposition is only correct in that some of the emails were indeed sent by men. Not much of a supposition really given that all of the e- mails must have been sent by either men or women. Some of them were from women.

Oh give over Dildo the "(men)" part in the title would be almost universally interpreted to mean including men, not exclusively men.

Why are you defending the abuse of a woman for taking maternity leave, by not exclusively but including men.

Other articles have also pointed out that men were in the majority of complainants.

Can we move in now?

Maternity leave is a problem in politics and I believe Stella Creasey was the first MP to EVER take maternity leave as recently as last year.

It is asad reflection on the state of Women's rights overall in the UK.

^ to be clear, I don't want to move in with you.

Yes, your assumption was entirely correct and, having seen some examples of the comments, the men involved were quite weird.

Like the man who wondered why she couldn't take time to respond as she was sat at home; or the one who was pissed off that having been voted for she had the nerve to stop working just because she had given birth. The one who didn't think MPs should take maternity leave at all.

Most of the comments I saw ignored the fact that all queries had been responded to by her constituency office. They just wanted to know what gave her the nerve not to be doing the job they may or may not have voted for her to do and were paying for via taxes.

There was a lot of angry and exasperated tone in many of the queries. Damn woman! And they were equally dismissive of the male secretary trying to explain the situation.

It was on points west last night (bbc) and they quoted, emails from constituents, mostly men. Apparently because she wasn’t available to be a punch bag for the boho/Cummings situation.

Yup! Men held her to account for not personally responding to their complaints about other men.

Despite the fact that an office including men had responded!

And also, why be abusive? They aren't just disagreeing if the staff are talking about involving the police.

I was being provocative by making a supposition which turned out to be correct. If you're not interested in feminism Gronky, perhaps you should hang out on a different board.

It's a bit like someone who hates cats hanging around the Litter Tray. Just a bit odd frankly.

Men are angry with her for taking any time off, for having the temerity for getting pregnant in office. And calling someone a lazy cunt behind their back isn't the same as sending abusive messages

It's a bit like someone who hates cats hanging around the Litter Tray. Just a bit odd frankly

No it isn't. That's a ridiculous comment. Women's rights affect everyone who is a woman, regardless of whether or not they agree with the particular brand of feminism you follow. That comment just telling women to shut up because they don't agree with you.

Oh give overDildothe "(men)" part in the title would be almost universally interpreted to mean including men, not exclusively men

Oh come off it.

If you're not interested in feminism Gronky, perhaps you should hang out on a different board.

Is my "not [being] interested in feminism" a supposition, a provocation or a provocative supposition?

And calling someone a lazy cunt behind their back isn't the same as sending abusive messages

It was in a reply-to-all email and she was very hurt when she unfortunately read it (an oversight on the part of personnel) but abuse isn't a contest.

Who is a woman more likely to receive abuse from - a man or a woman?

Who is a woman more likely to receive abuse from - a man or a woman?

I believe it massively depends on the lifestyle of a particular woman. For example, I almost never interact with members of the public in the course of my job. Even when I do, it's not as a service provider so I'm unlikely to suffer the slings and arrows people in the service industry might endure. I'm also heterosexual but have also been single for a long time so I'm unlikely to endure abuse at the hands of a partner and even less likely to endure abuse from a female partner.

It would also depend on what your threshold is for differentiating someone being unkind from someone being abusive (I believe the legal definition would be too high to account for what a lot of people consider 'abuse').

I was trying to dig up some statistics on workplace abuse but was unable to find studies with a breakdown that listed the sex of the perpetrator vs victim. Another issue I would identify is that perceptions of 'abuse' vary from person to person but, more pertinently to this, an interesting suggestion here is that the sex of the perpetrator might play a role:

www.telegraph.co.uk/women/politics/female-leaders-likely-accused-bullying/

Would it itself be a form of abuse if a woman had to endure allegations of bullying where a man would not over the same behaviour?