There has to be a word...

[BlueRaincoat1]

...for biologically female people, i.e. people who are of the sex class which produces large gametes, generally have xx chromosomes, and have common biological traits of having a vulva/ vagina and associated other biological characteristics.

There has to be language which easily allows for people with these characteristics to be grouped together. Obviously this word has (and still is) women /girls, but in expanding the meaning of these words to include people without these characteristics the words become meaningless as the biological category.

Do people who want to expand the meaning of the word woman think it is entirely unimportant that there be a word which easily allows people who have these characteristics to be easily classed as a group?

Genderism doesn't have a word for adult human female

Unfortunately, they say AHF doesn't need a word, that on the off chance or in the unlikely situation you might ever need to refer to adult human females, just say "adult human females".

So ok, logically minded non-botherered people will accept this to a point probably, so that the word "woman" is inclusive of transwomen and might not always mean someone who is an AHF, because hey, we've all heard TWAW and going along with it is cool and trendy.

Where TRAs have caused the most harm to their own cause is actually claiming that transwomen are adult human females. That's the moment for the average generally accepting, not bothered person, where they fall down the rabbit hole and take the red pill.

It's almost funny that a thread celebrating IWD was derailed by a discussion on the definition of the word 'woman', yet this thread is like tumbleweed.

I wonder why?

Cis (as I understand it) means that your gender identity matches the sex which you were observed to be at birth. But what about people who simply cannot have a gender identity- babies, people with severe cognitive disabilities. They cannot have a gender identity as presumably, by anyone's logic, you need to be able to have a sense of yourself in the world to have a gender identity

But what about people who choose not to align themselves with any gender identity? Don’t they have the right to do this? Can’t their “ sense of themselves in the world “ be unrelated to gender?

What about those whose “sense of themselves” is about sex / class / occupation / hobby/ ethnicity / whatever ?

Otherwise it’s like insisting that everyone must have a religion and refusing to accept that anyone could be atheist.

As I said on another thread, cis is superfluous.

We aren't a subset of the category 'woman'. We are the whole damn category.

Let’s just reclaim bitch and be done with it

We are seen as bitches for being terfs and what not, so let’s just call ourselfs bitches and done.

I think as well, and maybe it's just me, but "identity" has kind of morphed too. I have a feeling now that it's more common to sort of latch on to aspects of your personality or physical characteristics and make them your identity if that makes sense, whereas before I don't really remember that being a thing?

Sort of the difference I think I mean I suppose would be like me saying "Hi I'm Harriet, I'm a woman and I'm autistic and I'm a gamer." or me saying "Hi I'm Harriet" and the person I'm getting to know will eventually learn that I enjoy playing games in my free time (well I don't really anymore) and maybe work out or be told that I happen to be autistic and that I happen to be a woman (well I think that one would be fairly obvious).

I don't know if I'm saying what I mean very well because I'm really not sure how to word it, but I feel that there is a shift from "just being" to "identifying as" and it's not just related to gender identity but to other things too. Maybe it only exists online, I'm not sure if it's such a thing in the real world - though I wonder if it is more common in the real world with younger people.

I like the slogan on the Six parties thread and it seems fitting for this situation.

#TheWordWomanIsTaken

I can’t tell if your op was being facetious or not but my radar is a bit off as not feeling well.
As you know, there is a word. We just need to continue fighting men who want to appropriate it and twist its meaning to suit the misogynistic men’s sexual rights agenda.
We are women.

While I think woman and girl are taken - by us - and we should get to keep them, that's not working at the moment in terms of legislation and other situations where an authority insists that TWAW.

Female is a good word, as it isn't new and it's harder to argue that TW are female. Even my totally cult-brainwashed NB TRA family member grudgingly admits they TW are male for medical purposes.

I was also thinking I quite like "wom" , if it didn't sound so daft.

Totally agree Harriet. Gray Crosbie who was given a hard time on Twitter for that poem about their non-binary haircut, has another poem out about trying to pin down their identity correctly. The blurb says something about how they weren't sure exactly what the right labels were for them or something.

It makes me want to scream! Maybe you don't actually need a load of labels (none of which can ever accurately sum up your personality anyway)? Maybe you could just be a human being, which would make you unique anyway just like everyone else? But lots of people now seem to require a special labelled identity and to require everyone else to know about it.

I'm from a generation/culture where being labelled and bleating on endlessly about yourself were both seen as a bad thing, so hey what do I know...

TRAs saying we need one word for everyone who identifies with the female gender.

Not sure what that word could be, without ruling out all women who don't identify with female gender stereotypes but who don't claim not to be female/a woman.

Essentially they want a word that covers people in a group plus their imitators.

Woman is the word. It's taken and not up for negotiation.

No ifs no buts (and no willies)

The word women literally only applies to me if it is sex-based.

I do not 'identify' as a woman because I have no idea what it means to do so.
I have never felt feminine.
The closest thing I have come to 'feeling' like a woman was when I was pregnant, giving birth and breastfeeding. Which obviously doesn't work for gender-based definitions.

But just because I don't feel like a woman doesn't make me a man.

So if woman is now gender-based, then I am not a woman.

So to all those who think we're terrible people because we say that transwomen are male - what's the word for me that also includes transwomen?

Women are not people-who-are-not-men. Once again, I am astounded that this viewpoint is seen as progressive and not sexist claptrap.

That text identified as something more coherent before the rewriting.

The only reasonably intelliegent and necessary use of the word identify I can recall was back in the day when safe sex advice needed to also be aimed at men who had sex with men but who didn't identify as gay men (or bisexual if they were also married to a woman, say). So material aimed at gay or bisexual men wouldn't be noticed by such men. The point being though that the objective issue was whether or not they had sex with other men, and that their subjective labelling of themselves as non gay men might hinder communication. That their subjective experience was hindering important communication about a very real issue.

Whereas nowadays, why should we care about what 20 special labels you want to chose to label yourself? And why shouldn't we object when you try to use one that is already taken and does not apply. Whether it is about an objective fact of sexuality, sex, or ethnicity...............