Protecting naturism

[lafemme]

Radio 4 piece on at the moment - director of British naturism is campaigning that naturism should be a protected characteristic: shouting at a naturist to put their clothes back on should be a hate crime. Its a philosophical ideology and as religion, should be protected....

He gave the example - if a family is in a park playing football and someone shouts 'stop f*cking playing football' that i would be a crime and therefore shouting at a naturist to put clothes back on should also be a crime. A hate crime.

It was a bit of a fuzzy debate as it didn't discuss where the naturism would take place and whether or not this was in the 'public sphere' or not.

What about my philosophical belief that I would like to be able to enjoy a walk through the park without being exposed to an unwanted penis and be able to shout 'put it away'

I heard this - I thought the bloke sounded ridiculous!

But I did feel red flags pinging in my head - reading Dr Em's work on the various way PIE-types are STILL trying to infiltrate society, and trying to "destigmatise" public nudity as part of this.

It also put me in mind of this article www.buzzfeed.com/lorynbrantz/i-went-to-a-nude-beach-and-it-was-kind-of-a-nightmare

And it also reminded me of last year on Maspalomas Beach where a rather large man decided to bare all, and the children were they thought it was hilarious, but also my DD was mortified and didn't know where to look

Nudity - fine, up to a point. bBut where does public nudity cross over into exhibitionism/something a bit more sinister. I personally don't want to see a stranger's naked penis lolling about on a beach.

The naked rambler was regularly in my area since the police in Perth would drive him from prison to the next region so they didn't have to deal with his next arrest. He did have a psychiatric assessment as ordered by the courts and was not found to be mentally ill, although there was definitely some kind of weird obsession at play.

Nope, I don't want to see a cock flopping around in public, no matter how innocent the cock owners intentions are. Asking a man to put his dick away is not a hate crime.

Reminds me of when my friend went on one of the Naked Bike Rides.

She went to put her point across for safety and health as a regular cyclist. She returned disappointed and annoyed. As well as people who clearly rode regularly it seems it was attended by men who rode like they hadn't for decades and stopped regularly to stand next to their bikes for a rest, staring intently at some of the younger women.

It could have been completely innocent but my friend had that creeped out vibe that a lot of women get but ignore. She said it could have been a great day but it was spoiled for her by several men that obviously weren't there for the ride alone.

These creeps need little excuse to get their penises out in public as it is.

I knew someone who did naked bike rides. He was a complete creep who had been asked to leave a club we were in for sending inappropriate sexual messages to women in the group.

The bicycle saddle and the unprotected nethers do not go together.

It's our friends privacy and dignity again.
There's nothing inherently wrong with nudity, but I don't want to see other people naked unless I've agreed to it.
Naturism is a hobby not a belief system.

I don't buy naturism as a belief system. I don't think it meets the sense of it.

Even if it was considered a valid belief system why would that mean naturists were entitled to get their bits out anywhere and everywhere? Religion is protected as a belief system but you don't see people taking communion in the middle of Tesco's.

It’s all just pushing to a place where any fetish is acceptable to play out in public and all boundaries, both legal and morally accepted, are removed.

The nudist beach in my city is very close to a kids playground. The public dick-floppers who frequent it are screened in by some big piles of shingle but they frequently like to parade about on top of the piles with their shaved bollocks out in full view of people who just want to take their kids to crazy golf.

We also have a naked bike ride and the demographic seems to be a 25/75 split between young women in body’s paint and creepy old dudes with testicles like an 8-ball in a sports sock. It’s grim.

Even if the creepy old blokes could somehow be persuaded to stay away naked bike riding strikes me as a terrible idea in general. Some activities just aren't nudity friendly. Think of the chafing!

I've nothing against naturism in theory but in practice allowing nudity anywhere and everywhere is obviously ripe for exploitation by dodgy types.

There's also a hygiene issue. People plonking their naked genitals here there any everywhere would be a health and safety issue surely?? I am reminded of the episode in Sex and the City with Charlotte's partner going naturist in her pristine apartment and her getting all stressed about the state of her sofa and chairs.

There is a good reason humans developed clothes. And the cultures that don't have them tend to live in very specific climates.

I know a case where a very dodgy older bloke in a position of some authority used to lure vulnerable young men to his house and then use the excuse of being a naturist to greet them naked and wander around adjusting his genitals in front of them. I’ve been very dubious about naturists ever since.

Football isn’t a protected characteristic so it wouldn’t be a hate crime. If it was the dog walkers at London fields would be regularly committing hate crimes.

I guess I’m a bit of a naturist, I don’t wear a lot at home, generally I strip down to pants or sweat shorts as soon as I get home. When my sons in bed they normally come off too. It’s not a desire to be naked as such, I just don’t like wearing clothes if that makes sense.

But there’s a difference between being naked at home and wandering around town doing the saturday shop. I do get naked on holiday, but I go to villas etc so I’m not sat around what is essentially a public pool naked. I don’t particularly want to see other people naked and I don’t want a large audience while naked myself. Although I did once naked ski for a challenge.

Ridiculous.
Shouting 'stop playing f in football ' is not a crime.
Shouting ' stop playing football or I'll kill you' is a crime.

Note the shifting of 'hate crime' from actual crime to anyone objecting to personal freedom of lifestyle choices in public.

Males in female spaces where those females are supposed to get undressed and be vulnerable without arguing
Nudity in public
Oooh I wonder what other major taboo area is getting gently and steadily loosened here so that when people say it's wrong and unacceptable it's a 'hate crime'?

There was a paper written about this. Enforcing public acceptance of nudity, and then specifically child nudity was one of the steps on the way.

More attempts for some men to be able to get their cocks out in public free from prosecution or penalty. It's never ending.

We could always set up separate shops, sports facilities, etc for those that want to be bollock naked and those that want to be in the company of those who remain clothed. Or even split the cities, towns into separate naked/dressed areas. I wonder how long it would be before all those young women who try to prove how open minded they are, would stay there, before thinking ‘fuck that! I’ve just realised how many perverts are on my side. I’m away to put sine clothes on!’

I know Jolyon wanted us to tut at miscreants, but at this rate tutting and saying "put it away, dear" will be a criminal offense subject to prison sentence soon.

Priti Patel -not everyone's favourite minister, I know - has insisted police have no excuses for failing to tackle crime. I see this as a move away from policing twitter to policing knife crime. So more laws to protect random self selecting groups will not happen, I hope.
Letting naturists roam freely is about 399th on my list of what the police should prioritise.
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/02/26/priti-patel-police-have-no-excuses-failing-tackle-crime/

I used to use naturist beaches quite a lot, but eventually got put off by the number of naked male 'birdwatchers' standing on the cliffs and dune tops with binoculars and cameras, some of them with obvious erections. And of course, there was always semi-hidden 'activities' in the dunes.
Now I only go to official naturist clubs, where you need permission to use a camera and any hint of misbehaviour gets the offender immediately thrown out and blacklisted.

I prefer to be naked. I think the way that our society views nudity is wrong, I think it’s perverse and mentally damaging. That doesn’t mean that I think I have the right to impose my belief of preferences on others.
There's a huge naturist (FKK) movement in Germany. The thing is: they know to be discreet and keep their private areas. You might go to the beach, and see a sign pointing to the "FKK" area.

I lived next door to a naturist family. They were the nicest, friendliest people you could imagine, a couple, now retired, with two kids, now adult. They often invite the neighbours over for drinks, dinner, barbecues, etc. In 20 year I've never once seen any of them naked, and they never talk about it or make a big deal out of it or try to promote it. I would never have known, had I now been told by others.

You can be naked without being pervy about it or impacting others who aren't interested in your exposed body parts.

Jeremy Vine had this topic on his show yesterday.

Male naturist's answer to woman caller objecting? Called her a prude. Lovely guy. She's not allowed her opinion so we'll shame her.

Women are being shamed into going along with this bullshit and more. Valid concerns about safeguarding from the inevitable perves once more being ignored.

I've been flashed quite a few times, most blatantly and shockingly for me was in Woolworths as a young teen after school and still in my school uniform. An older man actually wearing a 'flasher mac' that he opened with his hands in his pockets. This was decades ago and it still turns my stomach to think of it.

He got away with it as I was so shocked I froze. How many others will find it even easier to get away with it? It's not on.