A powerful interview with a lovely young woman about FGM

[JustonTime]

It's an interview conducted by an Irish comedian who hosts one to one interviews now. The lady in question (Ifra?) gives a very powerful interview.

Can we discuss this?

She stated that there is a 98% uptake in Somalia of FGM. She is not being heard in Somalia when she is trying to change things.

Is there anything that we (or I) can do?

Horrific.

I will watch, thanks OP.

Wow. I thought it was a minority thing in countries that practised it

What can we do ?

There is a large part that is to do with people thinking it's normal or just a part of their culture, so raising awareness can help. Because that can show how abnormal and horrific the archaic practise is

There are charities that work to counter it, unicef for example talk about how different approaches are needed in different counties.

Yes, she explains quite well, how difficult for her even as a native Somali woman to try to get through to people as it's so embedded in their culture. They told her to go back to Ireland!

8 years old though, with not even 2 paracetamol? Holy heavens.

She mentions the Ifra foundation which I will donate to. Sounds like she takes a very hands-on approach, dealing with individual cases where the girls are bleeding for hours or whatever.

It seems such an insurmountable task!

Off topic, but she's a wonderful ambassador for refugees.

Just last week actually, thanks to the legislation she helped to bring in in Ireland, 2 parents were the first in Ireland to be jailed for FGM under the new legislation. That sounds like a good deterrent to others in Ireland who might wish to do the same. As she said, if she can save one girl.. I suppose that's where you have to start. Baby steps.

When I think about it, Ireland was so behind Europe and the UK on so many things, just 30-40 years ago (contraception, divorce, homosexuality, abortion to name but a few), but we have managed to drag ourselves out of the dark ages somehow, so there is some hope that change is possible. I think that is in part as a result of the Irish diaspora bringing their 'modern' ideas home and normalising a different way of life. Obviously, probably the main factor was us beginning to question the authority of the Catholic Church - which they actually facilitated themselves by the horrors they were responsible for. There were also a lot of very strong educated women speaking out. Our first female president, Mary Robinson, was an avid feminist. But it took time.

I don't know how far away from that a country with war which is a Muslim country might be from embracing change, but if Ireland could do it, then it's not entirely impossible.

Google Waris Dirie.
She has been campaigning for over 30 years and her personal story is shocking and heartbreaking.
Why is it taking so long?

I should mention for the context of the interview, that I think it's the format that Tommy doesn't know who he'll be interviewing, so he's going in blind - if some of you were wondering why he seemed to be asking stupid questions.

I think there needs to be a grass roots movement, so someone like this woman, who is actually from there, might be listened to by the women in society, more than a foreigner. I will google Waris.

It seems they women themselves know that it's wrong, as Ifra mentions talking to the other refugees she was travelling with and they knew enough not to want to mention it in Ireland.

It's very much a feminist issue and one that I think the women involved will need to change. I wouldn't be depending on men to do anything about it. It's their idea in the first bloody place!

Anyone who speaks out about it is very brave as, she says she was receiving death threats for speaking about it. Presumably from the African community (read MEN) in Ireland.

I wonder if it would be possible to fund some legal test cases on behalf of the mutilated girls, against the cutters in these African villages, for grievous bodily harm?
If several of them were ending up in prison and losing their livelihoods, or being sued for thousands in damages, it might help to discourage the others.
Most of the charities I’ve supported in the past seem to try and do it by education and persuasion of the whole community, but it’s a dreadfully slow process.

If something is very widespread I suspect people would clam up , drive it underground?

Thanks for the reply Babdoc. I felt like I was in a wilderness here!

That's a really good point - thinking outside the box there! Clearly it's governments that we'd need to petition in Somalia for example in order to make it against the law. Good way of thinking about it!

Maybe we could get Bono on board! He seems to have a good relationship with some African leaders. A cause for Meghan Markle to take on too perhaps?

@JustonTime

Probably outing myself to my sister, but I spoke to my mum's women's guild group on FGM a couple of years ago - they were very much of the white, middle class, older female persuasion, and they were horrified by my talk, the concept, the statistics, the suffering.

I read Waris' story as a child in the reader's digest, and I have never forgotten, or stopped reminding people. As upsetting as it is, I hope I will never stop telling people about the reality our sisters face, every single day.

Clearly it's governments that we'd need to petition in Somalia for example in order to make it against the law.

Article 15 of theFederal Constitutionadopted in August 2012 prohibits female circumcision but there's no effective criminal proceedings against perpetrators. There seems to have been one prosecution in 2018.

It's very much a feminist issue and one that I think the women involved will need to change. I wouldn't be depending on men to do anything about it. It's their idea in the first bloody place!

I don't think saying it's men who are to blame is particularly useful. It's clearly deeply ingrained in Somali culture and women will be doing the cutting. Any campaign and action needs to involve men and women. Women can refuse to act as cutters and to report when it happens and men, because it probably will be men, need to police it and prosecute case.

Not sure what you are asking here- you are asking how you/we can help the women and girls suffering fgm in the U.K. and abroad?
Personally as someone who is not from the communities that have the tradition of fgm I’m not sure how much influence i’d have, so it would make more sense to me to join with one of the organisations already up and running with local communities in this area rather than trying to start something new.
Not sure how much influence bono or Meghan markle would have either with these communities either to be fair.
Looks like there are several charities and campaigning organisations set up already working with local people to raise awareness and support victims of this practice.
Here is one
www.28toomany.org/signup/
Could be a good place to start?

You mentioned that it is men who have opposed the challenge of the practice of fgm but I think women have too. I think it’s based on the (very unhelpful) reasoning behind it and the fear that their female relatives will be unmarriageable in a society where a single woman can’t earn her own keep (and is possibly also a source of shame to her family?) So a cut woman could have better prospects of survival than a single woman. Bit harsh but I guess that’s the reality they are living with and it’s quite a complex thing to challenge.

I think the best way for western women to support anti-FGM campaigns in third world countries is probably to give money. Getting Bono involved would be very 'white saviour'. There are laws against it in most countries but getting communities to testify against each other is hard.

What we could do here is campaign for more people to be prosecuted here for performing FGM. The only case I'm aware of was against an NHS doctor who was stitching up a woman after birth. But we know the procedure is performed here lots and nobody gets prosecuted. Weshouldn't pretend it is only something that happens far away.

Wow, that made me cry. The betrayal, of having your grandmother hold you down while your great-uncle cuts you.

Tommy doesn't know who he'll be interviewing, so he's going in blind - if some of you were wondering why he seemed to be asking stupid questions.
I thought he handled it really well - he was clear, sensitive and concentrated.

Cutting is an utter outrage and it is so embedded in the cultures that practice it. There was a positive article on the BBC a while ago, though, which showed change was possible.

It made me cry too.

In cultures where girls are dependent upon marriage to men for their survival and the custom of FGM is practiced to make girls acceptable to men as marriage partners there absolutely does need to be men involved in changing the men's attitude toward this custom.

Men have no need to change their attitude. It's not them being mutilated.

Heartbreaking beyond words. The abuse and horror, but when that near-universal, the road to abolition is going to be long. Just horrendous, the abuse meted out to women simply for being women.

Thank you for the suggestions on ways to support efforts there to effect change.

If someone is coming to save me from getting sliced into, I don't care whether he or she is black, white, pink, alien, a little grey, yellow, purple or green. So don't give me that 'white saviour' shit.

You care what colour the policeman is who comes to rescue you from an assault?

I remember the documentary a few years ago about British activists in this field.

The documentary showed conversations with young men from communities where FGM is rife. At first they seemed to say 'nothing to do with us'. Then one said that he would choose to marry a girl who had been brutalised like this because his mother had told him to make sure he married 'a clean girl'. He clearly knew what she meant.

It makes sense that what boys and men believe and are taught about women in their societies influences the lives of women. Of course women like this boy's mother and the cutters are part of the system. But the men have to rethink their attitudes too.