Boycotting the Census?

[Alicethroughtheblackmirror]

In the CTEEA committee meeting today, Joan McAlpine pointed out that 3% of the sample of 2000 members of the public said they would consider not answering a sex question if it were based on self-identity.

Nat Records for Scotland have made a big play about the possibility that a fraction of the trans population might not answer an actual sex question, but they don't seem to have been too worried that women might object, and they don't seem to have tested for women's likely non-response.

Would Mumsnetters consider boycotting the census if the sex question is a de facto gender one such as is currently proposed by both NRS and ONS?

I'm going to put "none of the above" or " I have breasts and a vagina what do you think I am?"

Do you know what the fine is?
I think they get you anyway, even if you camp on a field for the night.
They have eyes at the back of their heads.
Besides, you'd want your descendants to be able to see where you lived and your biological sex.

Nice response trapped !

It does seem slightly ... murky, that they refuse to answer the question about who is asking for self ID. Surely this is all absolutely tickety-boo and above board, so why would it be an issue?

Why don’t we all invent a gender identity for gender critical people. Gender refuser? GenderIsNotRealist? Physicalists (in the metaphorical sense)? Just put that down instead?

From previous threads on FWR and having done the test Census I think most people will be unaware that when you get to the question on sex there is an option to NOT enter the sex you are born. (You have to actually take the time to click on a more info link.)

There is a later question which is optional which asks about identity.

So in fact it is more like that trans identified individuals will not complete the sex question unless they take the time to look at the additional info option.

Either way the "data" this census will collect will be flawed. Because even though I suspect 99% of the population will not think or be aware they are being asked a trick question, there will be a sizeable % who wont complete the sex question (as outline in earlier posts on this thread) and some trans individuals who think they are being denied the right to claim to be the other sex.

It will be a fudge.

Imagine if every GC person did not complete the "gender" question and then had a long conversation about the issue with whoever contacts them to get the information.......I'd like to see how they can help me work out my gender (once I've explained the difference between sex and gender and my issues with self-id).

I will not be completing a question about self Identified sex if that is how it is framed, they can call me and find out why that is. I believe it renders all the data completely useless.

As I said, the sex question is set out as being straightforward. So most people will complete not aware that there is a proviso that you can choose not to enter the sex on your birth certificate.

The self identity question is optional.

If it's computerised, what is the betting you won't be able to move on or submit the form unless the compulsory fields are filled out?

I agree with the wait to be contacted and then explain, in great detail and at length, why this is really not a good idea.

I imagine that's right: that if you complete it online, it won't be possible to...erm...express your strongly held views about the sex question.

However, anyone will be able to request a paper copy. I imagine many older people who are not comfortable with new technology might do so but they have to make that option available to everyone.

The census authorities might need to brace themselves for a larger than anticipated number of requests for paper copies...

Perhaps take inspiration somehow from the 1911 Census, when some women gave their occupation as 'Suffragette'

Will there be a non-binary option? If so, and you're completing online, what's to stop you selecting that?

And if there's no non-binary option, how are NB people supposed to answer?

I need to give some thought to my occupation. Being pro women & GC has pretty much consumed me for the last 2 years (I know, many have given far more years than me) so I guess it is my full time occupation.

Very happy for as many choices of labels to be added as wanted alongside a compulsory biological sex question, but not to co operate with a census that is open to being filled with preferred instead of real information, and the waste of taxpayer time and money on what makes a useful exercise into a highly expensive piece of pointless virtue signalling likely to damage services for all..

Beautifully put.

This isn't my census (I live in Australia) but this discussion reminds me of the Suffragette boycott of the 1911 census: www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/HistoryofBritain/No-Vote-No-Census-1911-Census-Protests/

(I hope you don't mind me suggesting that you publicise the problems with the upcoming census as widely possible: the more people aware of them the bigger the impact of any protest you'll be able to make.)

No I wouldn't. I found the census invaluable when tracing my family tree and want to provide that detail for generations to come.

“Boycotting the census is an offence.*

Civil disobedience has a long and interesting history. I should imagine if self-ID comes into law, many women might identify as men and deliberately enter men’s spaces to demonstrate the idiocy of the law...

I would find that question inaccessible. I wonder what arrangements they will make for those of us who can’t lie or participate in mass cognitive dissonance due to a developmental disability - or just on principle.

I think regarding the online form previous posters are right, you'll have to answer to move on and most won't be aware of the guidance as it'll just say M/F in options. So I agree with howonearth, it might be worth getting a paper version to write on!

I was pretty surprised that as many as 3% said they wouldn't complete it if that was the guidance.

What struck me about that though was that it gave the lie to the idea that they were really concerned about reducing non-returns. During session they say they want to reduce that from last time when it was 0.8%. But if 3% are already objecting to a self ID question, with growing noise around GRA, that's likely to go up surely?

Today no NB option for sex question - I think that'll be in gender id one.

I think someone in session (maybe Joan?) did suggest that NRS had been determined to do that and were only stopped by committee scrutiny. But I might have been on a coma induced by the waffle of Pete Whitehouse by that point!

Yes! I would get a paper version and I would make amendments to the question and would answer only the mandatory questions... oh! Wait a moment! That would be only religion and sexual orientation wouldn't it?

Maybe I would just write an essay over the Gender bit!

Interesting about the Suffragette boycott of the 1911 census, thanks!

I’m thinking about responding but not answering the sex question. The NRS said that the whole point of the self ID guidance is to get more people to answer the sex question as 0.8% of people didn’t answer the sex question in the last census. They don’t seem to have considered that it might have the opposite effect. The sex data won’t have any meaning anyway once it is self ID so no point in answering.

I would consider a boycott also.

I shall put for 'sex' that I haven't decided yet.