$13mn compensation for pornography

[Chocolatemice]

Its gone now, but there was an article in the New York Times about women who were being awarded compensation for being tricked and bullied into pornography. One woman who stood up to her abusers had the film sent to people in her professional and personal life.

hoodathunkit , your situation was nothing like these women's situtation.

To suggest any kind of comparison is setting up a straw man of the worst sort.

hoodathunkit , your situation was nothing like these women's situtation.

To suggest any kind of comparison is setting up a straw man of the worst sort.

I disagree

I was groomed when I was living in poverty with a disfunctional and abusive family

Most of the Jane Doe's in the porn scam were vulnerable and in need of financial assistance

I was groomed and coerced via false promises and lies

Just like the Jane Does were

I experienced a "bait and switch" in which the choices I made were part of a scam, a crime a deception which took me down a long twisty rabbit hole of gaslighting, shame, blackmail and basically my life going down the drain

Just like the Jane Does

Of course my situation was not identical to theirs, but there are many similarities

Have you read a first person account of one of the Jane Does?

Here, read this and then tell me that this young woman does not deserve out support

www.thedailybeast.com/she-was-18-and-tricked-into-doing-porn-this-ruined-my-life

To suggest any kind of comparison is setting up a straw man of the worst sort.

How so? If hoodathunkit sees parallels how can you be sure she is wrong and that there is no comparison?

You clearly blamed porn performers for "impinging on other women" earlier. Taken to the next logical position, if women are encouraged to avoid entering the sex trade willingly (which is a good thing, obviously), what happens when the porn or prostitution industries have insufficient women to exploit?
They just kidnap or traffic them. India for example has a burgeoning porn market, much of which is filmed rape. It's largely due to data speeds on smartphones making mobile porn a possibility. But there are not many women would would go into "glamour modelling" or "cam girl" work so almost all homegrown content is filmed rape, sometimes of prostituted women.

In that case the women involved are still, by your reckoning, "impinging on other women", and contributing to the porn industry too, but against their will.

I don't read Hippo's posts as any sort of feminism.

The women responded to an ad for modelling then were flown across the country and put in fancy hotels. It was then revealed that they were to do porn but female stooges reassured them it would be foreign DVD only and it would take about an hour. They were also told they’d be liable for the hotel and flight costs if they didn’t do it, while stranded in a new city. Some were plied with alcohol and drugs. All were rushed and pushed into signing a contract. It would take a lot of determination and guts to back out at this point, bearing in mind this company were experts at conning and coercing.

During the 4 hour (not 1hour) porn shoot, at least one objected to the pain and bleeding and asked to stop, repeatedly. But she was told it would be a breach of contract so she had to get on with it. Sounds awfully like rape to me. But whatever you think it is, these women have been abused, and then their lives subsequently and intentionally destroyed. Several suicide attempts among them. One has had lots of plastic surgery to try to stop being recognised.

Yesterday , Vice was pushing some video about a bloke having to discuss his porn acting with his grandma. ‘How awkward!’ Was the premise to the story. The contrast is quite extreme.

Agreed, Pencils.

Cwenthryth, you asked How people can watch these videos if they know that the women are being lied to, plied with alcohol & drugs etc... - you attribute way, way too much in the way of conscience to these men.

Either they just don’t care in the slightest, or, as FlyingOink says, they actively get off on the abuse of these vulnerable women.

Some men - the ones who watch porn - are very good at dehumanising women. Man (and his right to sexual pleasure/orgasm) as subject, woman as object (whose feelings and needs don’t even need to be considered), as usual.

I counted five rapes in the testimony of the three women in the affidavit. Two rapes did not happen on set.

These were three women out of 22 who brought action. We'll never know how many other victims there were.

The crime of rape is either abhorrent or it’s not. The “type” of woman that it happens to is of no relevance.

At it’s heart sex is about pleasure (and procreation). The fact we have become so dysfunctional as a species that we have fetishised abuse as arousing wether or not consent is present or contracts have been signed should be a red flag to anyone feminist or not.

The crime of rape is either abhorrent or it’s not
It is abhorrent but it's not as simple as that.
Statutory rape is a strict liability crime, like speeding, where if you've done it, it doesn't matter whether you meant to or not. (Was there sexual contact between an adult and a child, yes/no.) Bear in mind this is the theory!

Rape is generally really poorly prosecuted (as is statutory rape unfortunately) and part of what Germaine Greer got roasted for trying to explore is the problem whereby there is a sliding scale of awfulness, where being gangraped, mutilated and murdered is on one side and a questionable drunken fuck both parties regret the next day is the other end of the scale (I can't think of a non-awful rape scenario so sorry if that comes across as dismissive).

There are crimes on the "less awful" side but courts are prosecuting based on what they consider as the "most awful" side. Greer suggested that lesser penalties (but more of them) would achieve greater justice than stiff prison sentences but only a 3% conviction rate, which is pretty much what we've got.

So I guess I'm of the view that not all rapes are created equal, in the same way not all assaults are. Rape is much more invasive and has the potential to create unwanted pregnancy or psychological trauma as well as physical damage, so in my view it should always be seen as more serious than non-sexual violence, but within the crime there are degrees.

How we capture that I have no idea, like I said it was difficult to think of a non-awful scenario - it's easy to see which are the worst but hard to argue which are the least-worst.

However I'd argue within that, rape or sexual torture that is broadcast and which creates additional psychological distress is more damaging for the victim. So rape porn should be prosecuted against with that in mind.

Fluffy do you agree that if a woman initially consents to sex but changes her mind and asks to stop, then to continue is rape? Do you agree that if a woman consents to some things sexually but is forced into doing other sex acts that this is rape? Do you think that because ched evans’ accuser consented to shag one footballer that she consented to shag a whole bunch of them?

The logic that you are using here, that some rape is not real rape depending on the type of woman that it happens to is one of the reasons why rape conviction rates are so disgustingly low. You are perpetuating a culture in which men feel free to rape, because of these low conviction rates, so you yourself are harming all women with your bullshit rhetoric. So you are a fine one to point the finger at prostituted women. Imho.

Didn’t one of the women have the video spread around because she asked to have another look at the contract? That doesn’t sound like consensual and knowledgeable signing to me.

I'd suggest a watch of "hot girls wanted" on netflix to get an idea of what porn actresses end up in, even when they think they are fully consenting to work in the industry.

We need to focus on the producers and consumers of porn (mainly men) and their desire for inexperienced porn stars rather than the girls and young women who initially think this is a good career.

But anyway. It doesnt matter the bigger question, if those women were unaware how the material they filmed would be used then they weren't consenting and that's illegal/breach of contract.