Hospital questionaire

[notangelinajolie]

I didn't know where to put this, but I know I found it alarming.

I came out if hospital yesterday and was asked to fill in this questionnaire relating to my hospital experience. I filled it in because I wanted to give feedback but there were 2 questions in particular that I couldn't answer.

Bluntly, most people just don't care.

I don't care about anyone's gender. It's waffle. Stereotypes, theorizing and waffle.

Sex matters, though. And can't be ignored, dismissed or distorted, no matter how much anyone tries.

It's like asking what age best describes how you think of yourself.

Ll83, honestly it really does baffle people.

DP has to deal with the results of questionnaires phrased in similar ways (by other people!) and says that people rarely know how to fill it in. ‘Assigned gender’ is particularly poor phrasing.

@DodoPatrol I agree assigned gender could confuse people but surely this particular questionnaire is easy to understand?

"Woman (includes trans woman)"

Even if you have never heard of trans woman you know what you are.

Perhaps q2 could confuse some but I still reckon you know you are the sex assigned at birth even if you didnt realise some people are not.

Muffle - My reference to elderly patients is not the slightest bit derisory

It is a statement of fact - the hospital population is naturally skewed towards the elderly population.

Older= More likely to be ill.

Elderly patients - more commonly now in their eighties and nineties - will not be part of the Twittersphere or included / a focus of the trans debate.

As for useful information - it's clearly a box ticking exercise and I expect the results of it will not be of any actual material use.

'Many patients in hospital are elderly and have no idea what this is talking about or are unwell

Why are there so many derisory comments about elderly people lately on MN? Why assume they don't understand genders/trans etc'

So it's discriminatory to consider what language will be most comprehensible for different groups of people now is it :D

Loads of very elderly people in hosp, dementia is a thing also. My FIL would be baffled at that question and he's only 76.

I think that it would also present challenges for other groups tbh. It's not commonly understood at all.

NHS should be looking to provide absolute clarity in simplest terms across the board.

They should also be looking to understand if there are differences in the way people experience things according to sex, it's a protected characteristic after all.

As it is you can tick whatever you want really. And no one has idea of sex of those who tick NB (most people in real life are not cis so if pushed, this is a lot of people) or other. They absolutely are explicitly not collecting data on sex of patients. This is non trivial.

Better questions.
What sex are you
Do you ID as trans

They will then be able to segment their data fully and see if there are sex based or trans based differences in experience.

Even 'Do you ID as trans' would puzzle all the people who have never come across this. There are definitely people reading that question who will be new to the whole ideology -- as nearly all of us were, 15 years ago.

I'm not talking theoretically about whether people might/should/ought to understand that question, LL, I'm saying that people don't understand it.

DP tries to put the results of questions like that into software and it buggers up the system, as so few people know how to answer. Apparently some just tick one or the other, some leave out both, some who answer both questions probably meant what they said and others are guessing (and will object when their next letter says 'Dear Ms Rodney Smith...').

I would now know what it was getting at, but now that I know, I object to it. I would probably grit my teeth for the sake of the system and lie that I have a gender that matches the imaginary one assigned (by whom? Certainly wasn't a doctor) at birth.

I wonder it this type of debate is happening in other countries on sex and gender.
I have relatives in Russia. It is difficult to explain to them the difference between sex and gender. Interestingly, there is only one word in Russian for sex and gender. So sex =gender.

@powershowerforanhour I'm pleased that's what the BDA ask for but have you seen the GDC 'equality and diversity' section recently?

I have emailed them to query why they ask "do you identify with the gender you were assigned at birth?" but do not have a section asking about biological sex. I am awaiting their response.

(PS this is my first post - I have been a lurker for a long time but have registered today as I have learnt a lot from these boards but am starting to feel I need to do more than just get cross about these issues!) Many thanks to those who have opened my eyes to what is going on

Welcome EnamelWoman

I like what CloseEncounters suggests:

1. What is your biological sex?
2. Do you confirm to the sexist stereotypes of this sex, or the opposite sex?

Too wordy, too polysyllabic and also needs an option of ‘or neither’ (I know you’re not seriously suggesting that phrasing).

Unwell people crossly ticking questionnaires with a manky old biro want short, easy, relevant questions.

I’d perhaps go with ‘Birth sex m/f’
‘Gender identity (if you feel you have one): m/f/prefer not to say’

Why though, is your gender identity relevant? In a hospital setting the relevant information is your sex?
For all sorts of reasons such as treatment, what ward you should be on etc

On paper forms I cross that nonsense out and write sex:female.
We had this rubbish with my daughter’s school and nursery, asking for her gender. I just crossed it out.
I was recently asked the gender of my cat as well. It was online so I could not change it

I'd have to say Other and No for those questions.

Because I'm not a woman in the way that transwomen are women, and I've been kicking back against the feminine gender imposed on me for as long as I can remember.

It's bloody irritating because I know full well that what they're actually trying to ask is my sex (and whether I'm in denial about it). But the phrasing gives me no choice but to erroneously identify myself as a woke idiot who doesn't understand biology while not giving them the one bit of information they want.

Why does it matter how people 'think' of themselves in a medical setting. All that matters is your bio sex. Nothing else.

And to be biologically correct it should say Woman (including transman) and Man (including transwoman).

I would be red penning all over the shop if I got that to deal with.

The hospital I work in has just switched to these questionnaires.

It’s too much.

Why would a hospital need to know if you 'think of yourself' as belonging to a group 'women (including transwomen)'? This group only includes 'women and TW who believe TWAW', and excludes women (and TW) who believe that women are females. Note that the 'men (including transmen)' also doesn't include TW who know they're men and TM aren't.

Whiever designed it is a fool and probably trained by Stonewall.

I give the same answer to all questions about whether my gender is the same as 'assigned' at birth (my employer loves questionnaires like this).

MYOB.

NB same answer to the are you gay/straight/bi etc. What possible relevance does my sexual life have to my medical treatment? MYOB. Fuck the fuck off with that noise.

The problem with just crossing out is that the form wont be changed.

I am a data specialist and am worried that collecting inaccurate or unhelpful data will lead to some very poor decisions being made.

So I am afraid that you and others will need to write to whoever to get this actually changed going forward.