Have the BBC dropped the ball here? Caitlin Jenner related...

[EntirelyAnonymised]

I’m watching a recent episode of the BBC2 tea-time quiz show, House of Games. One of the rounds is a sort of maths problem thing, they used the Kardashians as the subject matter for this particular game. One of the clues for the possible numbers is ‘Caitlin Jenner gold medals’. The photo attached shows the solved problem.

Surely ‘Caitlin Jenner’ won 0 medals? Bruce Jenner won gold. Or does Caitlin get het up about being ‘dead named’ but still want to lay claim to the glory of the male-bodied Olympian status attached to Bruce?

Is it a BBC booboo or are they ‘right’? Do all (positive) achievements just transfer over, even when the person wants to erase their previous ‘gender identity’?

Bruce Jenner won gold. Or does Caitlin get het up about being ‘dead named’ but still want to lay claim to the glory of the male-bodied Olympian status attached to Bruce?

I wouldn't have thought she would get het up, seeing as I watched I'm A Celebrity Get Me Out of Here and she mentioned her medals but also referred to herself as her old name too when referring to her past

Still Bruce Jenner according to the official record:

www.olympic.org/bruce-jenner

But IMDB have Caitlyn Jenner appearing in all the films ("as Brice Jenner") like this was a part she was playing.

Fair enough, it seems others get het up about the ‘dead-naming’ on Jenner’s behalf (Twitter, mostly). It seems Jenner doesn’t much care about people talking about Bruce. According to this 2017 Guardian G2 piece.. This bit caught my eye,

point-blank refuses to retire references to “Bruce” or castigate others who use it. This so-called “dead-naming” is a source of particular angst to many in the trans community, for whom use of their old names is associated with efforts to shame them. But, says Jenner, “I had a life for 65 years. OK?” Besides which, “I liked Bruce. He was a good person. He did a lot in his life. Oh, ‘he didn’t even exist’. Yes he did exist! He worked his butt off. He won the [Olympic] Games. He raised amazing kids. He did a lot of very, very good things and it’s not like I just want to throw that away.”

So, Caitlin feels that Bruce did those things and the reality is that Jenner had fuck all to do with the question writing on the quiz show. So, are we to consider this another example of the now Uber-woke BBC?

The IOC have changed the names of medal winners in the case of Korean-born athletes who competed for Japan pre-WW2 and were required to do so under Japanese names.

So, are we to consider this another example of the now Uber-woke BBC?

Yeah, I'd lay this one firmly at the doors of the Beeb regardless of my dim view of Jenner.

Of course only Bruce could have won the decathlon.

Women weren't then and still aren't now permitted to take part in an Olympic decathlon. We're too 'delicate' or some shit.

I think Bruce is correct here.

We talk about "Cat Stevens' records", even though he has recorded somewhat similar music as Yusuf Islam, when we are talking about the 1970s music it can only be Cat Stevens.

So the gold was won by 'Bruce'. The person, Caitlyn Jenner, is an Olympic champion. But I think in most circumstances you would refer to a person during their fame under their name at that time. And medals are actively won on a single occasion, so you would use the name at the time.

I would agree, BeautyFilter

Julie Bindel's article in the Critic magazine has an interesting passage about the BBC:

Among its recent appointments are Megha Mohan, the corporation’s first “gender and identity correspondent” and Ben Hunte, “LGBT correspondent”. Hunte thinks nothing of attending Pride marches as a participant and also reporting on those same marches. “I’m reporting on issues that we as a community are facing,” he has said.

Mohan and Hunte are both young and junior journalists, yet they have been appointed to cover one of the most contentious issues of the day for one of the world’s biggest media outfits. I have heard from BBC journalists that there is some dissatisfaction in the coverage that Mohan and Hunte are responsible for. There have been several attempts to interest the pair in a range of relevant issues, such as detransition/transgender regret; the cotton ceiling (lesbians being pressured into sex with trans women); the battle over single-sex spaces; and drag children. So far, nothing.

More experienced journalists at the BBC consider it neither professional nor prudent for the corporation to appoint such inexperienced correspondents to represent particular “communities”.

As for what experience, intellectual heft and not-being-an-impostor syndrome offer, look at the way in which Justin Webb reacted to Edward Lord trying to tell him off for an interview:

twitter.com/JustinOnWeb/status/1207595149796282368?s=19

No "activist with a microphine" (Julie Bindel again) is going to be that sharp with someone as bolshy as Edward Lord.

insulting language like "biological truth"

From the Edward Lord/Justin Webb link. How in fuck is that an actual quote?

They continue to transcend the possibility of parody. Is it the concept of biology he finds insulting, I wonder, or the concept of truth?

From the Edward Lord/Justin Webb link. How in fuck is that an actual quote?

Hubris and overreach, that's how.

I would suggest that saying Caitlyn Jenner is not incorrect. If Bruce Jenner has changed his name to Oliver Jenner, and was now more widely known as Oliver than Bruce, it would not be incorrect to refer to them as Oliver.

The point is, rather, that Caitlyn is the same person as Bruce, not that they are anything different but their name and appearance.

But IMDB have Caitlyn Jenner appearing in all the films ("as Brice Jenner") like this was a part she was playing.

IMDB do this for all people who have stage names, who have early work credit under their previous names.

for example Vic Reeves has his credits as Jim Moir in brackets.