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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Helen Islan at it again

57 replies

ArcheryAnnie · 17/12/2019 11:43

Helen islan - "mimmymum" - the notorious (ex?) Mermaids activist, is rather unwisely having a pop at women who want to maintain public space for women and girls to do sport in safety.

I wonder, is this the same Helen Islan who rather famously took a transwoman to court and lost? Who, exactly, is "trans-hostile" here?

Helen Islan also spectacularly misses the point that nobody is blaming "trans people". Plenty of trans people want to uphold single-sex services, although they are excoriated by people like Helen if they dare to say so in public. Personally I blame anyone, trans or not trans, who thinks biology is a real thing and that women and girls don't matter. I don't think Helen Islan is trans, and in fact, I blame her, and people like her, however they identify.

Helen Islan at it again
OP posts:
Michelleoftheresistance · 02/06/2020 10:13

What Grin

The number of times I've heard Frankie Howerd in my head saying that...

R0wantrees · 02/06/2020 11:19

Helen Islan "they'll literally weaponise anything...."

Hmm Its useful to consider that in understanding abuse/control pattern behaviours false allegations will often be admissions/projections.
TheProdigalKittensReturn · 02/06/2020 11:22

Its useful to consider that in understanding abuse/control pattern behaviours false allegations will often be admissions/projections.

Indeed. I would also note that unlike Helen most of the women she's shouting at have not hauled a trans person into court and had their case dismissed as utterly without merit.

Azerothi · 02/06/2020 11:28

I used to go to wonderful women-only swimming session. Only one hour a week but it was lovely.
All kinds of women of all kinds of races and religions, including Muslim. One day a man in a bikini showed up and got in the pool on this women only session and from then on this very supportive multicultural group was disbanded due to lack of 'interest'. What an odd way for the swimming pool company to phrase it.

Michelleoftheresistance · 02/06/2020 11:50

Azerothi the political lobby (and probably the male who blew that group apart) would see that as a deserved consequence to those women for their crime of failing to hurl aside their own needs and things like their faith, culture, fears, privacy, and be all about the male's needs, feelings etc, as male needs matter but female needs are just females being obnoxious and needing to get over themselves.

It's staggering how those who identify as women have such absolute lack of interest or care for women, or what they destroy for women.

R0wantrees · 02/06/2020 12:12

Indeed. I would also note that unlike Helen most of the women she's shouting at have not hauled a trans person into court and had their case dismissed as utterly without merit.

Miranda Yardley wrote,

'Regina v Miranda Yardley: More DARVO from Helen Islan'
POSTED ON 3RD MARCH 2019
(extract)
"In the Daily Mail today “Britain’s first transgender hate crime trial is halted after one day as judge says ‘there is no case and never was a case“, the complainant against me Helen Islan tries to distance herself from the proceedings which were brought in her name:

‘The decision to prosecute was made by the CPS, not me personally and I accept the verdict of the court.’

It does not surprise me she is trying to wash herself of responsibility. Having tried to blackmail the court by saying she was unprepared to give evidence unless her name was subjected to a press restrictions order, her evidence on Friday appeared to me to be incredibly dishonest as she attempted to distance herself from anything and everything she has said and done: apparently never having tweeted under her real name, it was ‘esoteric search engines’ which created and posted tweets under the name ‘Helen Islan’, as shown by screen captures of these tweets in the evidence bundle. In spite of admitting in her statement and even evidence given to open court that she was a volunteer with Mermaids, getting her to acknowledge anything was met with denial of the facts, attacks on my character and reversals… now where have we seen that before?

The upshot is, her evidence was like witnessing a tooth extraction. I suspect the judge agreed, from the way he was rolling his eyes and having to tell Islan to stop wasting the court’s time waffling and just answer the questions. Islan was so unreliable as a witness, so truculent, I would not have been surprised should she have been indicted for perjury.

Anyway, back to the original quote which I will reproduce again so that we are clear as to Islan’s words:

‘The decision to prosecute was made by the CPS, not me personally and I accept the verdict of the court.’

On 10 August last year, I received from Islan’s solicitors Mishcon de Reya a three page legal letter threatening me with a High Court injunction, action for defamation and a costs order. This letter was I believe funded by the Mishcon de Reya ‘Pink Law‘ initiative, so again Islan benefitted from LGBT without herself being a part of this world.

What a hypocrite." (continues)
mirandayardley.com/en/regina-v-miranda-yardley-more-darvo-from-helen-islan/

Mail on Sunday article by SANCHEZ MANNING and JOANI WALSH referred to above:

'Britain's first transgender hate crime trial is halted after one day as judge says 'there is no case and never was a case'

(extract)
On one side was Yardley, an accountant, who describes himself as a transsexual and identifies as a man, even though he underwent gender reassignment to become a woman ten years ago.

Despite his own experience, his contention is that individuals cannot change sex – and this has drawn fierce criticism on social media.

Giving evidence via video link was his accuser, Helen Islan, who is married with children and works with the trans advocacy group Mermaids, which campaigns for children who want to change gender. (continues)

Initially, Ms Islan’s complaint was dealt with by West Yorkshire Police before being passed to colleagues in Essex, who decided it was a hate crime.

But when the case reached court the defence referred to pages of social media posts in which Ms Islan herself was regularly tweeting about her trans child, about him taking blockers, that he had ‘come out’ at school.

The court heard that a simple search on Google brought up Ms Islan’s personal details, including a family photograph that she had herself posted.

At one point during the hearing, Judge Woollard said: ‘Where is the evidence [of harassment] taking into account the need for free speech? You have to show a course of conduct and at the moment we have one tweet.

Where is the evidence for Miranda Yardley outing Ms Islan’s son?’ Later he threw out the case and awarded costs to the defendant.

Yardley told The Mail on Sunday afterwards that he was ‘horrified’ by the decision to charge him, saying: ‘I faced losing everything I worked for.’

Barrister Amanda Jones, who has represented clients accused of ‘anti trans’ comments, said: ‘The police and the CPS routinely ignore rape threats, death threats and abusive material targeted at women online.

The entire criminal justice system is falling apart from underfunding and this case appears to have been a complete waste of public funds.’ (continues)

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6764763/Britains-transgender-hate-crime-trial-halted-one-day.html

Dances · 02/06/2020 12:20

Her life is one huge self justification of her parenting decisions.

Oncewasblueandyellowtwo · 02/06/2020 16:10

Helen tweeted Audible about Mumsnet saying that it is anti trans with no evidence except opinion pieces and tweets, and now she is promoting that article that is inciting violence against women... What kind of fools are Audible.

EverylittleAlps · 02/06/2020 16:43

A Tale of Two Twitters:

1 - La Scapigliata on DARVO:

What this man did is called DARVO - typical reaction by abusive men, and sex offenders in particular, whereby when confronted with their crimes, they Deny the crime ever happened, they Attack the victim, alleging the victim was a liar or that she attacked him, Reversing Victim and Offender (DARVO). So when I see a man who is campaigning to force teen girls to toilet, shower, sleep next to fully genitally intact strange men, and these men call those girls “bigots” and the women who fight for safety of those kids “child molesters” (mobile.twitter.com/lascapigliata8/status/1267775015900123138)

  1. Helen Mimmymum on DARVO:

Mumsnet are desperate for trans people asking for fair and equal treatment to be labelled ‘Men’s Rights activism’, because in doing so, they can position themselves as the ‘victims’ rather than the aggressors they actually are! #DARVO. One of the essential objectives by ‘gender critical’ anti-trans campaigners is that they must be seen as the victims at all times.

This is the greatest trick privileged powerful abusers play, and allows them to be able to abuse trans people without scrutiny or criticism.

(twitter.com/mimmymum/status/1267588309045383169)

EverylittleAlps · 02/06/2020 16:47

(End of that Scapigliata quote should be 'I know the type')

TyroSaysMeow · 02/06/2020 17:54

I loathe the fact that religious minorities and races are used to justify why we should have single sex spaces.

You're right that we shouldn't have to invoke other protected characteristics in order to get our own needs met. But equally I think it's important to highlight the issues faced by women in some religious groups.

It's that whole intersectional wossname, isn't it? It's a subset of women who'll be actively prohibited by their menfolk and communities from accessing services, if those services aren't single-sex. I don't know if "secular privilege" is considered a thing but we owe it to our sisters who don't have it to make sure their needs are met too.

user1471451327 · 02/06/2020 18:21

The situation for BAME and religious women is important. They are massively underrepresented in recreational sport (with consequential health and social isolation issues). Public bodies have a duty under s 149 Equality Act to pay due regard to needs of the potential and actual users of public services (and look at issues like why mixed services dont work for some BAME women) and make provision accordingly. The Southall Black Sisters case is very important about specialist provision www.casemine.com/judgement/uk/5a8ff71f60d03e7f57ea7eb0

Michelleoftheresistance · 02/06/2020 19:25

Mumsnet are desperate for trans people asking for fair and equal treatment to be labelled ‘Men’s Rights activism’,

The delusionality and denial is just baffling.

The lobby this Tweeter belongs to is not 'trans people asking for fair and equal treatment', but a lobby seeking to remove all female only spaces for all female people regardless of circumstance, because this benefits males. ie that the feelings and needs of a few males and their personal circumstances is always in every single circumstance, more important than the needs and situation and feelings of any female in the UK. The feelings and dignity and fairness for those males matters: yet the feelings and dignity and fairness of females is a lot of bad behaviour, lies and malice and should not be attended to. (Even when they are the same as the males.)

Please, someone, tell me where the fair and equal treatment is here for females?

Please, someone, give me some reason why this individual is somehow managing to call this privileging of males over females something different to male rights activism/male supremacism?

Anyone?

Michelleoftheresistance · 02/06/2020 19:28

And while you're at it, please explain the 'unfair' and 'unequal' treatment this lobby sees as wrongs in need of righting?

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 02/06/2020 19:41

@Dances

Her life is one huge self justification of her parenting decisions.
This^

I almost feel sorry for her, depending on what she has done to her child their really is no going back and she can't afford to have any doubts about her position.

FloralBunting · 02/06/2020 19:58

Some days I feel sorry for the women in the vanguard of attacking women's rights and protections, because so many of them believed a lie and did unconscionable things to their children under the guise of 'medical intervention', so I know their cognitive dissonance will be deafening and probably painful.

Other days I think that most women I know have suffered in one way or another and didn't turn that round to try and destroy other women, so Islan, Green, Jette Knox and all the other quislings bent on damaging other women can get stuffed.

Goosefoot · 02/06/2020 19:59

In Helen's defence, sort of, I loathe the fact that religious minorities and races are used to justify why we should have single sex spaces. I really wish people would stop doing it. Likewise when celebrities try and shield themselves with men with "gender dysphoria". Women are just never enough.

Part of this is just strategic, people have been trained to see issues mainly in terms of identity groupings.

But I think part of it is that in secular western society doesn't have a very clear or widely accepted consistent way to talk about privacy. We can see how some religious groups clearly say that men and women are different and that sex is only meant to be between spouses, and so on, and that some people believe that deeply. But our own society tends to dismiss that the sexes differ much or at all beyond the shape of their reproductive organs, is casual about sex and sexualised images or clothing in public, and in fact a lot of the social consensus in recent years has been against single sex kinds of groups.

This is why sports is one area where people tend to be more easily convinced, they can see there is a real issue physically. Sometimes they can with safety. But most western liberals are inclined to see things like prvacy and dignity as socially learned and maybe even oppressive.

aliasundercover · 02/06/2020 20:16

@TheProdigalKittensReturn
There was an incident at a Korean spa in Chicago and a university's changing rooms somewhere in the US that I remember offhand
I've done a quick search, but I cannot find anything about this online. I don't suppose you have a link do you? I'd like to read more about it.

OldCrone · 02/06/2020 20:47

[quote aliasundercover]@TheProdigalKittensReturn
There was an incident at a Korean spa in Chicago and a university's changing rooms somewhere in the US that I remember offhand
I've done a quick search, but I cannot find anything about this online. I don't suppose you have a link do you? I'd like to read more about it.[/quote]
This is the one I remember reading about - a transman who wanted to use a gay sauna.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/11/02/gay-sauna-criticised-telling-transgender-man-leave-female/

DickKerrLadies · 02/06/2020 20:57

@Michelleoftheresistance

Mumsnet are desperate for trans people asking for fair and equal treatment to be labelled ‘Men’s Rights activism’,

The delusionality and denial is just baffling.

The lobby this Tweeter belongs to is not 'trans people asking for fair and equal treatment', but a lobby seeking to remove all female only spaces for all female people regardless of circumstance, because this benefits males. ie that the feelings and needs of a few males and their personal circumstances is always in every single circumstance, more important than the needs and situation and feelings of any female in the UK. The feelings and dignity and fairness for those males matters: yet the feelings and dignity and fairness of females is a lot of bad behaviour, lies and malice and should not be attended to. (Even when they are the same as the males.)

Please, someone, tell me where the fair and equal treatment is here for females?

Please, someone, give me some reason why this individual is somehow managing to call this privileging of males over females something different to male rights activism/male supremacism?

Anyone?

Don't mind me, just joining the queue waiting for an answer to this one.
aliasundercover · 02/06/2020 21:41

I've now found an article about the cases ProdigalKitten mentions

www.americanthinker.com/articles/2016/04/the_transgender_threat_to_boys_and_men_.html

The article itself is not that good, but it does have a few interesting links. Thanks for bringing them to my attention ProdigalKitten, and thanks OldCrone for your link.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 02/06/2020 21:44

Both incidents were on feminist blogs at the time but I'm not sure those blogs still exist, what with the way Wordpress etc have been shutting any criticism of TRA actions down.

Fallingirl · 02/06/2020 23:17

But I think part of it is that in secular western society doesn't have a very clear or widely accepted consistent way to talk about privacy.

I think this is key. It has annoyed me for a long time, that most men and some women, only understand the issue with men in women only spaces in terms of safety.

Most people accept that the probability of being raped must be minimised. But the universal declaration of human rights names ‘privacy, dignity and safety’.

I think it is an interesting question why this culture seems unwilling or unable to understand the concepts of privacy and dignity other than for women of certain religions.

Is it, that men are actually very willing to agree that the mighty penis would surely be threatening to the penis-less half of humans, but the concepts of privacy and dignity don’t praise penis so they refuse to think about it?

Is it that the so-called sexual revolution, that won some women the right to say ‘yes’, but made it a lot harder to say no and be heard, also sought to re-conceptualise having boundaries as old fashioned and unsuitable for modern women?

That would certainly tally with the postmodern claims that we mustn’t kink-shame, sex-work is work, and primary school children should learn about masturbation.

I honestly think we need to have a massive push for boundaries, privacy and dignity to be understood as not only acceptable, but actually desirable.

Pthagonal · 02/06/2020 23:31

“‘Multiple exclamation marks,’ he went on, shaking his head, ‘are a sure sign of a diseased mind.’(Terry Pratchett in “Eric”)

Ereshkigalangcleg · 03/06/2020 00:55

I think this is key. It has annoyed me for a long time, that most men and some women, only understand the issue with men in women only spaces in terms of safety.

Me too. Particularly because it leaves it open to the TRAs to come back with either "there's no safety issue, cis women abuse too" and/or "it's not faaairr to penalise trans women for what cis men do"

But tell me I don't have the right to privacy and dignity, you're going to look like the misogynist you are.

I honestly think we need to have a massive push for boundaries, privacy and dignity to be understood as not only acceptable, but actually desirable.

Yes, absolutely.

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