DM - autism stats within young transitioner population

[Mumsnut]

Can’t link from phone but the Daily Mail has an article on this today

Also the known link between anorexia and autistic girls has significant similarities to the the link between ROGD and autistic girls.

Those with eating disorders from sexual abuse or autism need different treatment protocols to recover. Why would ROGD be any different?

Good article here

www.spectrumnews.org/features/deep-dive/the-invisible-link-between-autism-and-anorexia/

Autie infodump - apologies. I don’t actually think the finding your alternative tribe is new behaviour for those on the fringes. It’s just the current best fit tribe comes with permanent body alterations which are a lot more significant than tattoos, piercings or extreme hair and dress which can be changed later.

I was a goth. It was prescriptive, easy to do, gave me something to hang my hat on and I could presume weird looks were from the goth look rather than me.

Smallblanket - that sounds incredibly hard. The link I put up about autism and anorexia had some interesting tactics which could be used for treating gender dysphoria in autistic people. The approach to food of looking at nutritional data to be able to make a scientific choice was very interesting, also the habit breaking and recognising all the reasons why you are doing something not just the one you’ve decided it is. Hard facts that can be applied are good to get a different perspective. Sideways rather than direct confrontation so the autistic person adds information into their current truth.

I’m currently watching a lot of 70s feminist documentaries around my children which provide all manner of useful information and atypical women but they are early teens so less entrenched.

I’ve posted our situation over and over again on these boards over the past few weeks (sorry! It’s cathartic!). My 14 year old DD is likely high functioning autistic but refuses to get a formal diagnosis. She also decided at the beginning of October that she is a boy. She’s had a long history of obsessional fantasies and playing the role of various characters- when in character, it takes over her life.

To me, deciding she is a boy, feels the same, but this time it is (more or less) socially acceptable to be trans, whereas before, eventually her one friend at the time would get fed up of being some fictional character and tell her to stop or drop the friendship. As a boy, she has now managed to be part of a small group of girls for the first time.

DH and I had a meeting with a new therapist on Friday and the therapist wondered whether in DD’s head it is easier for her when she is acting socially awkward in the group, to think her friends thing, “Oh X was being a bit odd, that’s because she is a boy” rather than “Oh C was being a bit odd, that’s because she is autistic.”

I think there is something to that. We’re avoiding the NHS route like the plague- they take a medicalised route, we think watchful waiting plus therapy for our DD is better.

I have a child with adhd/autism and one with FASD
The service was poor for the ADHD/ASD and pretty much ritalin or nothing
The FASD even worse. Nothing. Some children can't even get the diagnosis and is totally dependent on area. Once you have the diagnosis there is nothing at all

@Smallblanket are you part of any of the twitter support groups like @Bayswatersupport or @OurDutyGrp? If so, I probably “know” you. If not, come join us.

Rogdmum - the therapist has described exactly what I did when I was a goth. I could separate the angst from getting it wrong from me as a failed person (undiagnosed ASD at the time) and hang it on the goth thing.

You can’t separate the autism from self because it’s not a choice.

The trans identity has a cachet about it which other girls will want in their group it’s one of the reasons why it’s an attractive and dangerous option. It’s similar to the way flamboyant gay boys have a cluster of female friends. It adds cool not removes it.

Oh and role play is what all autistic women do. Masking. Gives you a persona to use. Being a boy can be worked out to a basic level and then interact within the role. The clothes, hair, belongings are easier and less social nuance is expected of boys. More black and white choices if you are playing a stereotype which is necessary to “pass”.

Thanks, Catalogue that was really interesting to read,

rogdmum - if you haven’t already done it block twitter, Reddit and tumblr. Limit YouTube (very tricky to do) and any other forums/websites which would facilitate immersing herself in the ideology. One of the treatment protocols for hospitalised anorexia patients is to remove as much access to anything that affirms or encourages it.

Read this and replace anorexia with gender dysphoria, the similarities are chilling.

s.telegraph.co.uk/graphics/projects/inside-the-world-of-anorexia-blogging/

Oh and role play is what all autistic women do. Masking. Gives you a persona to use. Being a boy can be worked out to a basic level and then interact within the role. The clothes, hair, belongings are easier and less social nuance is expected of boys. More black and white choices if you are playing a stereotype which is necessary to “pass”.

That makes a lot of sense and it terrifies me watching my DD. It was alright for me. I suffered a lot as a child but eventually I made friends and they just accepted me as a bit of a wierdo but essentially nice guy. It isn't till seeing this issue with my DD that I have realised what was wrong with me (although my DW had been saying it for years). I have no idea how to protect my DD from this inevitable onslaught. I've been telling her so often that I love her just the way she is, that now if I say "I love you" she replies "just the way you are" in a bored voice 😂. Hopefully in the middle of those hormone fuelled chaotic and painful years, she will remember that at least her mum and dad love her as she is and she doesn't have to pretend to be something else for us.

My 15 year old was diagnosed with autism in September. There is absolutely no support for autistic young people. We left the appointment (that he wasn't even invited to) with a handout giving us details of local charities and groups and were told there is nothing else.

I have been trying to get him support as his late diagnosis has caused significant mental health issues. He has now been referred to camhs but we have been told that will be rejected. School pretty unsupportive too. We have been left to try and help him with nowhere to turn. Diagnosis and ditch.

Growing up is a very difficult time for autistic teenagers, they are very vulnerable.

hiddenmnetter try saying I love you all the time but x thing you did was amazing because x reason.

Like I really like the way you know lots of things about x because it is interesting and shows how clever you are. Try finding things to praise that are autism related. Like I know that it was really hard for you to do x thing but you tried really hard.

Getting praise for the specific ways you are different is important as otherwise it’s a tidal wave of negativity for autistic kids. So many “wrong” moments need balance.

Show young autistic kids the many ways autism has changed the world for the better. Tell them about autistic actors, artists, chefs. Not just tech people. We need to proactively show autistic young girls the many different exceptional kinds of women there are. It needs effort otherwise all kids see are whatever is considered cool now and who in that is autistic or gender non conforming? Quirky kids need shown quirky adults who are amazing. Something that tells them they aren’t wrong, they aren’t alone they do have a herd.

She's only 4 at the moment so it's all a bit early. Still waiting on the appointment with the community paediatrician to confirm the suggested diagnosis, but right now she's alright (as the article above noted, primary school isn't so bad). How we can help her in 10 years time... Well, as you say, specific reinforcement of autistic traits as positive is a good idea.

Punxsutawney autistic kids are totally abandoned. My youngest was diagnosed and we received zero help. Every single change that has been put in place at school has been forced by me. No help with social skills, no emotional support. I’m fortunate that I understand it from the inside but it is in no way easy. Having your own social communication difficulties when negotiating with people who are supposed to know how to deal with autism really shows up why kids are drowning. It’s intensely draining trying to put in all the support needed by yourself and parents of kids with additional needs are on their knees.

This is a really good article about the sorts of questions to ask a child who says they want to transition: www.objectnow.org/news/2018/3/23/born-in-the-wrong-body-first-do-this-by-caroline-franssen

When my DS was diagnosed, we got a photocopied leaflet from NAS (What is autism) and sheet with a list of local organisations (which they couldn't assure me were still operational) and then we were discharged from CAMHS.

They were at least a bit apologetic

Two dds here. I’m petrified my 10 year old could get hooked into this. She has asd and adhd and is in a mainstream school. I was very much non gender conforming and so is she. I’m also weary as the high school she is due to go to is a Stonewall champion. I’ll be watching very closely.

I suspect any teenager with a tumblr habit could convince them they were suffering from dysphoria
Ironically that site has gone through similar and now has a fairly sizeable radfem contingent. Some clever young women on there.
The article had this (pic) comment at the bottom and it summed it up for me

Good luck to all of you struggling with supporting an autistic child.

The high number of autistic children, especially girls, in the trans stats makes perfect sense. Not only fixed ideas, black and white thinking, but the fear of change, sensory issues. For many girls, the really dramatic physical changes of puberty can be traumatic. For a child with autism, this sudden projection into becoming a sexual object, the physical changes to their body which are out of their control must seem unbearable. My DS has autism. He is so mortified by anything and any reference to sex. He used to cry at the idea of growing taller, marks from his sock tops on his skin would throw him into panic. Even new clothes are a challenge as he wants to hang onto his old ones even when his jeans are swinging round his ankles.
I can only imagine for a girl with ASD, the changes in body appearance, the way breasts feel on your body, wearing a bra, the paraphernalia of menstruation, the way men/boys start to look at you must be utterly overwhelming. How much sense would be being a boy? Retaining that sense of yourself as you.Not this weird, horrld interloper.
I am on a fb page for parents of ASD children. The number of them welcoming their child’s transition without question is just chilling.