Rain Dove: I'm conflicted

[WomanBornNotWorn]

Rain Dove is a US fashion model, 6'2" by the time she was ten, with both a "masculine" face and an impressive figure.

Not surprisingly that's brought a lot of difficult situations, and Rain has developed some amazing people management skills demonstrated over on Instagram with screenshots of online conversations.

They're a masterclass in dealing with aggressive confrontational behaviour, understanding that it often comes from a place of sadness and fear, and I will be taking notes.

However.

I first became aware when friends were sharing one of the conversations as 'beautiful'. So I looked.

A mother had contacted Rain in despair because after reading Rain's Instagram her ten year old daughter was asking for a binder, and she was blaming Rain for influencing her child.

By the end, Rain had convinced her that the child would be using dangerous improvised methods to bind anyway, so she should get her the binder.

I'm conflicted - I'm admiring the communication, self discipline and influencing skills while at the same time appalled how easily they can be used to persuade a mother that she should enable her child to bind - using nothing but the best.

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-7765539/Gender-fluid-model-Rain-Dove-praised-patient-response-angry-stranger.html
www.independent.co.uk/life-style/fashion/rain-dove-model-defying-gender-norms-fashion-industry-men-women-clothing-firefighter-a7832991.html

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-7765539/Gender-fluid-model-Rain-Dove-praised-patient-response-angry-stranger.html

I've read this... sounds a bit... strained.. I'm not convinced the 'ranty mum' was a real person personally.

Not a real person, turns out the pics were from a stock photo site. Dig into the actual Facebook thread to see.

It's clearly fake. No one talks like that and nothing Rain said in the exchange warranted such an abrupt change of heart.

Breast binding a child is abuse. Rain is condoning child abuse and being celebrated for it.

Oh my god I saw this the other day (one of my woke Insta friends shared it) and I did think the very quick change of heart was a bit bizarre. So it's fake then? Which pics are you talking about because she did say that the profile pic wasn't real.

When I dug into Rain Dove's Instagram I too was a bit conflicted. I can see what she is trying to say, and she was talking about being really careful about what binder you choose and that they can be damaging, but at the same time seemed to be pushing them as well? She is very beautiful and a lot of what she is saying makes sense, but then encouraging binders cancels it out.

Sorry, I have used 'she' here, I don't know what Rain Dove's pronouns are...!

that text exchange reads very, very oddly. The reference to “strap thing” (showing naivety I guess), when a mom in that situation would know the word “binder.”

Also weird to share such a personal exchange (including mom’s face!?) with the world.

Oh sorry just saw that profile pic was na made up one

The mums profile picture is fake - Rain said this was to protect her identity.

Still, a very strange 180 degree turn very quickly!

It reads like it's totally fake.

Protect her identity? When every parent of a trans child trots their pictures and info (including birth certificates!) online at every opportunity? Bullshit.

Looks like bullshit to me. Sorry. So, if I ever were to have been conflicted about Rain Dove, I'm not now. The whole conversation (if it happened) had a creepy, groom-y, vibe.

There's already a thread about this here:

Article about 'non binary' www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3762588-article-about-non-binary

Another crest in the tidal wave of shit that is normalising young girls hating their own bodies. Rain Dove is suggesting that if this mother doesn't buy her daughter a binder then she will self-harm or may even commit suicide. If that is the case then this young girl needs COUNSELING. Binders do not fix gender dysphoria, just like diets do not fix anorexia.

So much bullshit.

Is the daughter 10? Not many 10 year old's have breasts do they? So I guess that a child of 10 who has developed so early might feel very weird about her breasts and wish them gone. She probably feels different to her female peers and gets a lot of comments on them, especially from boys. She is likely finding it hard to retain her identity as a child which at 10 she very, very much is and her upset and resentment is focussed on this womanhood that's been thrust upon her too early in her emotional development.

The very first thing to say to the parent of a child of that age who is experiencing a hatred of her body, is that her feelings are very normal in a child who develops early. That in a few more years, as more of her peers start to develop and she feels more 'normal,' and even the envy of her late developing peers, those feelings could dissipate. So the priority is to acknowledge that her changing body is a source of conflict for her right now and help her through it in as positive a way as possible.

Sorry, I have used 'she' here, I don't know what Rain Dove's pronouns are...!

Which just goes to show what nonsense all this pronoun business is in the first place.

Given how many internet influencers have confessed to being paid by lobbyists and corporate interests to promote their agenda I tend to look askance at all of them now.
Caveate Emptor is more important these days than ever before.

So the child is likely to self harm so the mother should get in there first & get the child a binder & help her self harm?

(I know the child is fictional)

Breast binding a child is abuse. Rain is condoning child abuse and being celebrated for it.

Yes. So I'm not conflicted at all.

I mean, I'm sure that Rain thought that was going to be a brilliant mic drop moment, but maybe Rain should have tried to make her stock photo evil mummy a bit more convincing.

If Rain was brave enough to stand up to the gender related bullying by rejecting gender ideology completely then I'd be praising her. As is it look like a case of someone who really, truly ought to know better.

that text exchange reads very, very oddly. The reference to “strap thing” (showing naivety I guess), when a mom in that situation would know the word “binder.”

Posted too soon.

that text exchange reads very, very oddly. The reference to “strap thing” (showing naivety I guess), when a mom in that situation would know the word “binder.”

Yes the mother struggles with the word binder but effortlessly used millennial and absent millennial parents.

The volte face was impressively quick.

So, Dove has made up these comments and then shared them to display her saintliness? [I think she is the correct pronoun here, mods, if not maybe someone can correct me and direct me to the re-education suite.]

Do people not have better things to do?

The most likely explanation is that it's a paid advert for the brand of binder mentioned.

If the child was threatening to self harm by cutting, would Rain advise getting her a Sabatier knife to stop her using a rusty razor blade because she's going to do it anyway ... ? To me, it's the same thing, yet several woke Facebook friends are cooing about how beautiful the conversation is!