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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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OP posts:
Gingernaut · 01/12/2019 08:09

...."sex work has been going on for thousands of years and sadly no policy will end it”. So has murder, but I have yet to hear calls for its decriminalisation.

This.

BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 01/12/2019 08:09

For some reason I read that as 'Julie Burchill' and was pretty Confused until at half way through the article I checked the by-line!

When feminists support the sex trade, they are giving men permission to buy and sell the most disenfranchised women on the planet

this. what sort of fucking useless feminist supports this?

Ummmmcake · 01/12/2019 08:10

It has now happened three times that I have read an article written by/interview with a "happy" prostitute defending her chosen profession only to find another article by/interview with that same person some years later in which she states that the first article was caused by denial of the situation she was in and in which she admits that she now has PTSD caused by her work in the sex industry.

BovaryX · 01/12/2019 08:16

Thank you for the share token. Interesting article. Good to see Julie Bindel highlighting the complete capitulation of Labour, Lib Dems and Greens to this lobby group. ‘Hands off our punters?’ How very progressive.....

BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 01/12/2019 08:21

it's so goddam obvious that prostitution is not a free choice. because women with choices don't do it for fucks sake

it's just that some people think men's desire to wank into women is more important that protecting vulnerable women and make good choices available to them. fucking prats.

looking at you Amnesty you traitors

HandsOffMyRights · 01/12/2019 08:22

Superb, Julie. I'll keep this in my pocket for the next time some bearded bloke tries to pretend that prostitution is both liberating and empowering.

ThePankhurstConnection · 01/12/2019 14:12

it's so goddam obvious that prostitution is not a free choice. because women with choices don't do it for fucks sake

Absolutely this.

My standard reply is 'I'll believe it is normal work when YOU are doing that job and telling me it is just work', until then I'll be the one protesting to protect vulnerable women and calling out the trafficking of women and children.

2Rebecca · 01/12/2019 15:33

If it was an acceptable job it would be advertised at job centres, discussed at career talks and people could be sanctioned for not taking up these jobs. It isn't because it is generally accepted to be an exploitative trade where one person pays another to be an ejaculatory receptacle.

BickerinBrattle · 01/12/2019 17:12

If it were work like any other, job safety standards would apply, which means all prostituted women would have to wear latex gloves, respirators, goggles, and possibly even haz-mat suits.

If it were work like any other, anti-discrimination policies would apply, which would negate consent.

If it were work like any other, sexual harassment would be just a requested expansion of one’s job duties.

MaryMungoandMidgetoo · 01/12/2019 17:23

Thank you for the link.
So only the Tories haven't tried to decriminalise prostitution. Interesting.

Also interesting to see the Amnesty comment. One of DD's teachers wants her to join the school Amnesty club as she is interested in current affairs and people's lives - it's all I can do to stop myself going in to ask if the school is including prostitution in its career's advice.

Fallingirl · 01/12/2019 17:42

I think it is always worth asking prostitution suporters whether they think we should introduce realistic exit strategies for every prostituted woman.

If not, why not?

If yes, let’s do that first, and then return to the discussion. If the strategies actually are realistic, there won’t be many prostituted women left.

definitelygc · 01/12/2019 17:48

In case anyone's missed it, Julie is doing a talk on prostition in Bristol on 10th December

www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/julie-bindel-talks-back-tickets-82878442653

Fallingirl · 01/12/2019 17:56

It is also worth thinking about, that many women in that situation, will be doing their damnest to hold on to their dignity and self worth.

In our current society, agreeing that you are a victim of anything, is interpreted as you admitting to being a non-agentic ‘loser’. The shaming of the very concept of victimhood, is doing profound damage to people in disadvantaged circumstances.

It makes it so much harder to name your oppression, when the world around you, and its neoliberal worshipping of ‘choice’ and ‘agency’, informs you that if you cannot claim choice and agency in most aspects of your life, you are somehow a lesser person.

This redescription of social constraint and societal inequalities, that shifts responsibility on to the individual, has the result that women in prostitution (as well as everywhere else), to hold on to their sanity and dignity, will often tell themselves that they are choosing what they do.

Until they get out, and looking back can see the abuse for what it was.

CivillyServant · 01/12/2019 18:22

Ummmcakes do you have any links of these women writing for them against prostitution? I would love to share them with the next ‘sex work is work’ advocate

endofthelinefinally · 01/12/2019 18:31

Why is it that these supposedly educated people leading political parties seem to be totally incapable of thinking through their policies to the logical conclusion? Surely they must realise the implications for unemployed, vulnerable women needing to claim benefits, if prostitution is classified as legal employment/work? Are these women going to be told they must prostitute themselves? Work in a state sanctioned brothel (Holbeck for example)? Or have their benefits stopped?
I am enraged by so much of this type of nonsense. I don't understand what is wrong with people.

Ummmmcake · 01/12/2019 18:52

The articles were not in English, but if it had happened three times in the Scandinavian country I am from, it must also have happened elsewhere.

SapphosRock · 01/12/2019 20:13

Thanks for sharing. Julie Bindel is spot on and it's great this is being published in the Times.

I've heard her speak a few times on the subject and she does so brilliantly. A liberal feminist friend of mine was immediately persuaded so hopefully the Times readers will be too.

It's hard to argue with the logic when she lays it out so clearly.

BadgertheBodger · 01/12/2019 21:56

I fucking love Julie Bindel. Gives no fucks, always for women. Feminist to the very core

littlbrowndog · 01/12/2019 23:10

Thanks Julie

So true.

Oncewasblueandyellowtwo · 02/12/2019 14:38

I saw this thread on twitter a while ago, I can't remember how I found it, it is about an woman who was a porn star who died.
Reading through it is horrible, this is what the men who buy or watch this think.

mobile.twitter.com/complex/status/1174372404350599168?lang=en

Annasgirl · 02/12/2019 22:15

Just read that - so well written. I think I will save it to quote to anyone who attempts to argue that prostitution is empowering.

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