Violence during consensual sex has become normalised

[NeurotrashWarrior]

'A man tried to choke me during sex without warning' www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50546184

Research for 5 live.
Linked to the campaign we can't consent to this.

Stark reading but I'm glad it's getting into the mainstream press.

Parents have a responsibility to teach their children about consent.
When we discuss sex with my eldest DC (almost 13) I make sure he knows that porn is not a realistic sexual act and drum it into him about consent, natural bodies as opposed to shaven pubic hair ( although he knows that's ok if it's the woman's preference) fake boobs and sexual violence are not the norm.
He knows that he must have respect for what a future partner wants.
We have extremely secure age appropriate internet security but you know at some stage when he's older he's going to encounter this hardcore, degrading, violent porn and I want him prepared.
I'm raising a young man with empathy and understanding, not a future rapist or abuser.
More families need to have these discussions from the start of puberty and maybe we will have less of these fucked up beasts in society.
Having been subjected to an extremely violent rape in my 20's by someone I was casually dating ( no consensual sexual act had ever taken place and he was angry that I didn't want to continue seeing him ) I am determined my DC is the polar opposite of that man.

MzPumpkin yes to all that. And sorry you had such an experience.

Men expect to enact what they see in porn and most of that is violence and degradation of women.

And no Ashlee, it’s not just a few men, it’s an overwhelming number of men and it’s everywhere.

As a man I'm ashamed that my sex does this, I just don't get it.

I’m going to start using a new acronym.

A Hell Of A Lot Of Men Are Like That

I sense one posters may be of the furry footed, living under a bridge variety.

The only thing I'm surprised about on this discussion is just how quickly the NAMALT brigade were mobilised. Hopefully they put similar urgency into getting behind efforts to keep women and girls safe from predatory men

Pertinent thread:

19 year old DD tells me ALL boys want to throttle. www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3165779-19-year-old-DD-tells-me-ALL-boys-want-to-throttle

I think the most concerning part of the article is the second paragraph:

"Of the women who had experienced any of these acts, wanted or otherwise, 20% said they had been left upset or frightened."

So 80% were not upset or frightened by it. I've got a lot of female friends still dating / having one night stands and most of them have fully accepted choking, gagging and slapping as part of sex now. They wouldn't choose to do it but they wouldn't be in the 20% who said they were upset or frightened as it is so normalised for them. When I try to argue this with them I get told I'm out of touch or being old fashioned. Porn has absolutely ruined sex for young women and they don't even realise it. It's so upsetting.

Hah didn’t realise this forum was so against different opinions that your first few posts had to be in agreement with the hive mind

The article talks about two different things which shouldn’t be conflated:

• Women who had not consented to ass slapping, hair pulling and spitting during sex. This is similar to biting/scratching and will be experienced by men and women.

• Women who did consent, and asked to engage in risky sex with an untrustworthy partner that ended in a tragedy.

Everyone in this thread seems to be adding the two together to create this world where increasingly men are non-consensually putting women in mortal danger by risky sex moves, when in reality what is being described in most of the article is sex that is rougher than what one of the parties wanted.

Everyone is getting riled up about “violence increasing” but the evidence is that society is actually getting significantly more progressive with these issues. A celebrity slapping an ass the wouldn’t have caused a blink of an eye 15 years ago and now it will (rightfully) garner national news.

As a note on the above, to clarify, it’s clearly a everyone’s responsibility to make sure any sexual partner is comfortable and that any boundaries are avoided. Inevitably this requires communication from both sides and a receptive partner who has the same attitude.

Why did you miss out choking from the list, Ashlee?

Also, the article does not say "ass slapping" it says "slapping" and "punching".

What's in it for you to minimise this?

MRA alert.

Oh and a nice little disclaimer afterwards! "ooh, must clarify, it goes without saying that everyone must consent.." - and yet this article is drawing attention to the women who say they didn't consent, and felt frightened and intimidated because it happened during (previously) consensual sex.

35% of women have experienced violence and/or sexual violence. So what percentage of men perpetrate violence against women?

Its clearly a lot more then the 1% I've seen MRA's argue. (which is apparently the percentage of convicted criminals who are murderers, that being the only kind of violence that 'counts' apparently.)

When I think what teenage girls are growing up with, it's terrifying. This kind of violence has become normalised and it makes me feel sick to think my DD will be exposed to this shit soon.

Wtf ashlee. Why are you minimising male violence?

Women are absolutely not randomly belting their partner during sex. Or choking them. Women aren't increasingly watching violence against women dressed up as harmless porn.
I'm so sick of apologists on here.

I think our daughters will need a second Sexual Revolution. The first was in the 60s - they'll need a new one because feminism and women's rights has been debauched and appropriated by the sex industry in the past couple of decades - mainly due to online violent porn.

Oh dear anyone who thinks the issue is ass slapping is seriously out of touch. A friend of mine had a one night stand and half way through sex the guy wrapped his belt around her neck and started choking her. She never agreed to that. This is not an uncommon story among the women I know. I've yet to hear any story where the woman has done anything like this to the man.

Ashlee you're wilfully mixing "playful biting, holding down etc" with slapping, choking etc.
Why?

hmmm... mindgeek pays good money for keybord warriors I see...

whispers - your on mumsnet, noone believes a fucking word of it

@definitelygc That is appalling, even by the standards of many other similar accounts here and on other platforms. I would expect to die if I found myself in that situation. Your friend must have been terrified.
I realise there may be many reasons why a woman may not wish to make a complaint after an experience like this, not least among which would be not expecting the police to take a complaint seriously, but women really need to start reporting sexual assault to the police when men do things like this. Maybe when they start getting lots of complaints a penny will drop somewhere and the seriousness of this abuse will be recognised. Also it might help men to get the message that actually women do not welcome terrifying experiences like these, it's not sexy, it's assault if not attempted murder.

Go away "ashlee" and take your minimizing bullshit with you.

On a local mom forum I was on, someone was annoyed because she could hear her neighbors having sex. She described the sounds as normal sex sounds, you know, both groaning, woman gagging, choking, and sometimes puking. Nobody even commented on that! Imagine normalizing sex acts that end up in vomit or heavens forbid death.

It's so grim. Vomiting. Who enjoys vomiting as part of sex?

We know where this is coming from - hardcore porn online.

This documentary followed an English woman trying to get into the US porn industry. She goes to shoot with Max Hardcore - who is a pornographer on record as saying he wants to degrade beautiful women, because that's what men want to watch - beautiful women who they wouldn't get to sleep with in real life, being abused.

The documentary makers ended up removing her from his mansion - she was crying and choking as he had been suffocating her with his penis. He is filmed pressurising and emotionally blackmailing her into continuing. What about the women who don't have a documentary crew to remove them from this situation? What about the women who end up sleeping with the men who enjoy watching this shit?

It's here - posted with a severe trigger warning for nudity, sex and abuse.

Everyone should watch that video before they opine that porn is harmless.