R4 on detransitioning 8pm tonight

[bumpertobumper]

File on Four on Radio Four tonight at 8 will be exploring those who detransition and whether enough is done about other factors before transition.
I'll be tuning in...

Scientific uncertainty...
Some evidence for treatment is poor.

Young people often have other difficulties and need support from Cahms.

Speaking from the experience I’ve observed of a young trans person in my life, if they ‘decided’ they weren’t trans any more they would suddenly lose so many friends and support networks. Also after years of support it’s hard to say ‘I was wrong’.

This happened to me, sort of, I'd been a lesbian for a while, though I'm really bisexual, and I knew I wanted to date men but risked losing my community. It was horrible, it took me ages to actually do it, and lots of my "friends" wouldn't talk to me anymore, it was much worse than coming out in the first place.

Gender is being treated but nothing else is.

I just don't understand the angst about all this

Are you a parent?

There has been more than a 5,000% rise in girls identifying as trans in less than a decade.

Prior to that, the number of trans people was very low, steady, and for young people they were mostly boys who had gender dysphoris from a young age. Although we don't yet understand why they have GD, this group has at least been studied and we know a bit about them.

There has been next to no research on this new cohort of girls transitioning as trans, despite this massive rise in numbers. They typically don't have GD as young children - instead they suddenly ID as trans in their teens.

Many are same-sex attracted and/or have autism or other conditions.

GIDS and other medical establishments are treating them as if they're nothing new. They're not investigating why these girls are wanting to transition in such large numbers, nor doing any follow up to see how they fare long term, after medical transition.

The drugs being given to children as young at 10 stip them from going through puberty, make them infertile and in combination with the cross sex hormones that almost 100% of kids taking blockers go on to, run a serious risk of not being able to have sex as an adult.

Many people are concerned that young people IDing as trans in their teens or even younger aren't trans at all, but suffering a social contagion similar in some aspects to anorexia or self harm.

Meanwhile, in schools, organisations with NO expertise in child development, health, or safeguarding, such as Mermaids, Stonewall and Gendered Intelligence train teachers that they it's perfectly fine to hide a child's trans identity, to trans them at school. Parents have found out that their child has transitioned after the fact as the school has hidden it from them.

That our NHS is letting children as young as 10 make decisions that will render them sterile and possibly sexually dysfunctional for the rest of their lives, with experimental drugs that lack a solid evidence base, is an absolute scandal. And add to that, that it's largely lesbian, gay and autistic children who are doing this. There has been a shocking lapse in safeguarding and ethical practice.

As a parent I find it terrifying. Even if you're not a parent, surely you can see there is something deeply disturbing about what's going on?

Chart above from this article by Trangender Trend. Well worth a read:

www.transgendertrend.com/surge-referral-rates-girls-tavistock-continues-rise/

Some are detransitioning due to society not making them feel comfortable.. mermaids person.

Good grief mermaids are even more poisonous than I thought. They really will sink to any low to advance themselves and themselves only.

25 fold increase in a decade. ( Referrals to child clinic)

Girls make 75% of referrals

Gids not meeting referral times of 18 weeks. 2 year wait.

( Much like autism referral really)

Puberty blockers: presented by NHS as giving time to think.

puberty blockers now

now used from 10yo

parents who question now-
child affirmed from 1st appt, offered hormones to suicidal child

That poor mother with her bullied gay child

poor woman, voiced by an actor but she is tearful

Puberty blockers being proposed for a child with mental health problem is "like prescribing an anorexic a gastric band".

Change in 2014 to make available for younger children.

Endocrinology offered at first appointment for a distressed child. Parent treated as enemy.

parent: Kids immersed on line, bullied, super bright, seriously ill child. Parents support group are seeing this repeated in their group.

Judicial review mentioned.

parents and nurse asking for judicial review of use of puberty blockers

Leaving aside the "assigned at birth nonsense, this is a good programme, covering lots of important issues.

Some staff (at clinic?) had very serious ethical concerns...

A reasonable sign off with calls for more scientific research and more open conversation. However, apparently this is something "everyone agrees with".

Good to hear these issues starting to be explored.

Some big red flags embedded in there.

Signs that Mermaids is a lobby group, not a straightforward support charity:

Lui: "Some people detransition because they're not trans"
In a normal world, this would be an opportunity for the charity to say "and we need to understand this more so children and young people don't make life-changing physical choices that aren't right for them

But no, pay no mind to that, railroad on to point out

"But there are other reasons people detransition, eg hate crime, social pressure"

How do you know this, Lui, have you got stats on detransitioners and reasons for detransitioning? Oh no, you haven't, because it does not seem to be an area of concern or research for a childrens transgender charity.
In fact, for your CEO it's pom pom waving 'affirmation only' approach via WPATH all the way, isn't it?

Tavi rep: [on the huge increase in girls accessing GIDS] "I've looked at the numbers and thought about it, and I think the most likely cause of referral cases going up is that the service is more accessible and there are social reasons it's more acceptable to tell your family"

Really? You're the clinical lead of an NHS service, you thought a little, and you couldn't think further beyond these reasons?

Well done Charlie, Thain and Debbie - I know you're likely to be coming under increased flack this week for speaking up. Your voices are important.

Pom bear has it and another well done to Charlie, Thain and Debbie and the clinicians who appreciate how complex it is.

It is people like you who are destroying #nodebate but it is still brave to speak out. All power to you for doing it.

That van horn woman was very dismissive. She's had a quick think and a scan of the numbers and she can't think that ALL the drugs and ALL the hormones don't have a bit of an impact on those numbers? I wouldn't let her within 10 miles of my child.

I do hope that programmes like this and the judicial review make the watchful waiting approach a bit more appealing.

I hate to say it, given the recent past, but well done to the BBC for that.

Tavi rep: [on the huge increase in girls accessing GIDS] "I've looked at the numbers and thought about it, and I think the most likely cause of referral cases going up is that the service is more accessible and there are social reasons it's more acceptable to tell your family"

I was raging when she said that. How utterly disingenuous.

And a nod to the production team too, as I imagine the politics behind the scenes aren't easy right now, given the likely response from some areas.

As Floral's posted on another thread, her NB relative is posting about the programme being 'literal violence'.

In fact, a bit of a nod and empathy to those who have been blinded, through their use of 'terfblocker' on other social media, and the virtual media blackout over the last few years, to the fact that there is an actual discussion happening. And that the familiar methods of trying to control the discussion aren't working any more.

It must be frightening if you've been swept up in a world that tells you to demand silence from others around the truth, to never transgress from, or question your 'community's' point of view for fear of excommunication, and a community that demands that 'safe space' = never questioning things, ever.

That it's 'literal violence' that sometimes people need to talk about things, and understand that there may be a multitude of factors at play.

In fact, a shower of empathy on everyone!